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Speed Record for Slot Cars

28K views 133 replies 39 participants last post by  Gripping Pneus 
#1 ·
Is there a "World Land Speed Record" for slot cars?

I've been contacted by a group of people keen to make a record attempt - and they are keen to know what the current record is - if there is one!

I know the record for a lap of a 155ft King Track went over 70mph a few years back. Obviously slot cars are capable of going faster than this in a straight line. With a bit of development on gear ratios and aerodynamics they could probably go quite a lot faster in a straight line.
So has anybody actually measured the speed accurately?
If so please lets have the details.

Chris Frost

P.S. I know there was a thread on this topic last year, but it didn't tell us what the current record is.
 
#2 · (Edited by Moderator)
Chris
There is/was a speed record for a scale mile, which was run a while ago for James May of Top gear fame.
they were using scalextric cars ONLY, and some crappy timing system. This was for a flying mile, and the scale speeds worked out at something over 650 mph.
If you are going to attempt this again, please keep me in the loop, I would love to do this again using proper timing and cars.
Would you want to run standing start or flying mile, and what would the power supply be, all relevant questions, before you go ahead.
Feel free to PM me for any other help I can give

Zen
 
#3 · (Edited by Moderator)
Hello Chris,
155' (or 47.25 meters) in 1.404" is the current record on the 8-turn King track. Of course it makes the Scalextric speeds set on the Top Gear show a bit tame.

The ONLY absolute speed record I am aware of set as such (besides the Scalextric/Top Gear attempt) is the one set by Champion with three 707-powered cars in 1966 for 80 hours where they covered 1200 miles on an oval track set in a parking lot.
You can see the report HERE.

In 1971, Miniature Auto Racing tried to set a competition for a speed record for slot cars in the 3 scales, but it came to nothing.

There are some HO 24-hour records, but I don't think anyone as yet really tried for a straight-line record. I have little doubt that a wing-car devoid of much of its rear shovel running on 36 volts could top 200MPH, for about a second or two before the motor would go poof.
 
#4 ·
Seems the speed record would be in 1/24 slot drag racing, where I think the record is something like 4/10 of a second for the scale quarter mile - 55 ft. If my rough calculations are right, that's about 94 mph.

In scale speed, probably an HO dragster would hold the record, since you get to multiply the actual speed by 64 or 87, and these things are wickedly fast.

The Scalextric thing was more a publicity stunt than a real speed record, although it sounds like it was fun and achieved its purpose.

Don
 
#5 · (Edited by Moderator)
QUOTE (zendragon @ 4 Sep 2007, 13:44) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>There is/was a speed record for a scale mile, which was run a while ago for James May of Top gear fame.
they were using scalextric cars ONLY, and some crappy timing system. This was for a flying mile, and the scale speeds worked out at something over 650 mph.
Hi - the other postings on this thread are in actual speed
Not sure what the 650mph scale speed means
Is it anything like 650 divided by 32 to give a real speed of only about 20mph?
 
#6 ·
Hi Chris
You know we did a thread on this a year or two back and we believed that it had never been done
I think you can count out the top gear /scalextric event as it was acomplete farce with less than 1 amp power and timing equipment that only worked when pete doherty wasn,t taking drugs
I believe Haynes museum are going to reprise this event next year again with the help of scalextric but knowing how Haynes museum operates I wouldn,t bet on it happening
When I talked to you last year I had formulated in my head how it could be done ,and in fact when steve francis and myself were down at the brooklands 24 hour I did offer it to them and he asked me to put together a package and present it to them ,which as I am too involved in my book at the moment I havn;t done
I would think we would need about 1500 pounds to set it up but once it was done it could be run as an annual event for little extra cost a bit like bonneville speed week
I must admit I am not interested in scale speed as that is pants for this competition
I,ll tell you why
A nine foot chassied 1/32 car (Mustang /Camaro ) doing real 10mph would effectively be doiing 320mph scale
The same chassis would fit under a 1/24 mini /imp and give or take a few vagaries would do the same 10 mph real speed but that would be only 240 mph scale
Right having established that any self respecting record attenmpt would need to be substantially quicker than a king track average (70mph real ) or the terminal speed achieved by 1.24 dragsters (125 real mph ) we need to supply lots of power and lots of straight and provide safety for people watching as I suspect the speeds could be in excess of 150 mph and the cars may become aerodynamically unstable at this speed.

Any way if you trawl back to the previous thread you will see similar comments
I would be interested to know who your contact is Chris and do they have the spondooliks cos if they do I suspect Brooklands may well take it on

I think as it never appears to have been done before it could be sensational


Cheers tony
 
#7 · (Edited by Moderator)
20.8 MPH TO BE PRECISE.
As I say it was a publicity stunt for scalextric, and we had to use hornby parts they were scrutineered, not quite sure about the engine and gears in the winning car though. I am absoluteley convinced that the record would be broken by other makes, but it would depend on the regs, and that is were the problems would start, what would you be allowed to use, there are so many variables with different motors, gears bearings, and bodies, without the question of power supplies, where would you draw the line?.
I would still be interested in being involved with this enterprise, I might even be persuaded to offer some ideas for rules and regs.

zen



with all due respect to the other classes of racing
 
#9 ·
Tony and I have talked about this quite a few times during the past year, so I have few thoughts.

There are many 1:1 scale FIA ratified LSR's for different capacities, distances, wheel driven or jet powered "land vehicles", but the outright record is held by Thrust SSC a jet car, averaged over a two way run. I THINK that some of the ratified records are for one way runs. The distances are usualy 1 kilometer or 1 mile. I am not sure which distance the current outright record is over. There are also different records for flying and standing starts.

For practical purposes I would suggest that a slot car attempt is limited to:
1) Wheel driven 32nd scale cars, not jets!
2) Standing start scale 1 kilometer, a track 31.25 meters long plus a bit for deceleration, which could be aided by some short sections of reverse polarity and whatever system slot drag racing uses these days for catching the cars. If there was enough funding a longer track for flying starts could be built, something around 60 metres long. Only one lane is needed.
3) Three classes
a) Out of the box slot cars
b)Scratch built accurate (+/- 16th inch on all dimensions) 32nd models of record cars (Bonnevile Speed Week included)
c) Anything goes within a maximum width, length and height "box" as long as its wheel driven.

Could be fun.
 
#10 ·
Those sound like very good guidelines Dick - but as long as we're fantasizing, why not a scale mile?

Also, I would have tended to go for 1/24, as the traditional slot drag class, which would definitely work better in the USA, but 1/32 would probably appeal more in Europe.

Don
 
#12 ·
QUOTE does aerodynamic drag really have an effect on cars this small?

Yes! Just look at the 1/24 "wing cars" to see how aerodynamics have led to their design.

A simple test. Drive down the road at 40 or 50 MPH. Put your hand (a relatively small object) out the window and point it up or down in the air flow. You will feel a considerable aero effect. It may be less on a slot car but it will still be very noticeable.

Given that US HO drag cars topped the 100 MPH (real) barrier a few years back, I think aerodynamics is not something to be overlooked.
 
#13 ·
I personally feel critical mass is gathering this time! Do you guys realize that about once every 7 years since 1964 or so, this subject has come up, been discussed very seriously and then faded into oblivion once everybody realized the actual problems and investment needed?

And on the forums, the subject also comes up regularly about every 6 months - so as the intervals get shorter, maybe we're getting closer to a real resolution.... the Brooklands connection sounds feasible - and maybe Rolls-Royce and BAE would like to contribute a steel/aluminum/composite track and some space-age electrics....

Don
 
#14 ·
Odd you say it comes up every 7 years, Don! It was about 7 years ago that the subject was given serious visitation by the HO guys in North America. Because it was HO, they wanted to emulate Bonneville with a scale mile warm-up, scale mile timed section, and then a lengthy cool down section. It was forecast, based on the 100 MPH speeds reached in the scale (1/64) 1/4 mile, that speeds would likely reach 150-175 + MPH!

I have no doubt that 1/32 or 1/24 cars can reach or exceed the same level.

One of the key factors that prevented it from happening was the ability of someone to construct track modules that could be aligned and levelled with the sort of precision needed for cars travelling at such extreme speeds. Can you imagine a 1/24 car becoming airborne and leaving the track at 175 MPH?
 
#15 · (Edited by Moderator)
The usual reason for fizzling and fading into oblivion is persistent upping of the ante until it spirals into cloud cuckoo land, then crashes and burns ignominiously without a wheel ever turning. Actual events rarely take place.

Regardless of any mocking criticism, the Scalextric effort actually DID take place, which is a tremendous tribute to Scalextric/Top Gear, and most particularly to Adrian Norman.

The absolute essence of making an event actually take place is to set the parameters at an affordable and easily achievable level. One can always make improvements based on that first base line. But if there IS no first base line, then nothing will happen, other than a lot of hot air, as usual!


In my opinion, the Scalextric/Top Gear event event got a lot of basic things right , with flaky timing being the most obvious problem.
Better timing arrangements would not be difficult to arrange.

I believe it is highly desirable to use readily available plastic track and forget about purpose built precision track modules. Far better to have an event actually happen, albeit with less than perfect track, than not to have it happen at all because such a track is not available, or at least not at a price anyone can afford. To this end, sorry to say, but Sport track, with its less than ideal connections, is not the best. But there are others more suited to this purpose.

Another personal recommendation is to absolutely LIMIT the available power to a low level, but ensure that whatever the level chosen, it is consistent and close to bullet-proof reliable. A readily available, cheap and reproducible power STANDARD is essential. That would enable many more people to experiment themselves and then join in competition. Without popular support, such an event simply doesn't happen. In my opinion, the voltage should never exceed the 12-13 volt standard and amperage should be set at a low figure to start with. If sensibly low limits are not set, then the pie skyers (or should that be sky pie-ers) will be looking for a thousand amps and 240 volts in the rails.

I would also suggest that, if a future attempt were to be contemplated seriously in UK, it should definitely be based around the most popular scale of 1/32 and all others be completely forgotten about.

Enough - MAKE IT SIMPLE, MAKE IT ACHIEVABLE, MAKE IT APPEAL TO LARGE NUMBERS AND MAKE IT HAPPEN.
 
#18 ·
Probably slightly easier to organise would be a Nonstop Endurance Race as seen on the Carrera Website.

One car driven for as long as possible No pit stops for car OR Driver!

Current record 32 hours non-stop to cover a total of 320.12 km were driven (full scale 7682.92km).

I have to agree with Tropi on the Scalextric event as it actually DID take place, which is a tremendous tribute to Scalextric/Top Gear, and most particularly to Adrian Norman who threw the whole thing together in a matter of weeks which could not have been easy.

I had a great day out
 
#19 ·
QUOTE (TSRF @ 4 Sep 2007, 13:50) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Hello Chris,
155' (or 47.25 meters) in 1.404" is the current record on the 8-turn King track. Of course it makes the Scalextric speeds set on the Top Gear show a bit tame.

The ONLY absolute speed record I am aware of set as such (besides the Scalextric/Top Gear attempt) is the one set by Champion with three 707-powered cars in 1966 for 80 hours where they covered 1200 miles on an oval track set in a parking lot.
Thanks
So the King track record is an average between 75.2 and 75.3mph. (with timing to the nearest 0.001 sec you cannot say more accurately than that)
I know of a 24 hour race on a King track in 2005 where the winner covered 488.5 miles, which is a somewhat quicker average than the 1200 miles in 80 hours. Does anybody know of a faster 24 hour race?

Several people have quoted approximate dragster times that are faster than the King track record. It would be very interesting to see the exact times - any offers please.

Chris
 
#20 · (Edited by Moderator)
I'd say well done to everybody who got slot racing on Top Gear
AND well done anybody else who gets slot racing on TV

I'd say well done to everybody who organised that slot racing which people enjoyed
AND well done anybody else who organises slot racing meetings people enjoy

Am I going to say well done on a World speed record of 20 point something mph when races actually do take place every week where cars go MUCH faster than that.
I don't think so
 
#21 ·
Hi Tropi
What i was proposing is not difficult and not expenive you need about 350 feet of dead stright dead flat track you need 12 volts ,unlimited amps and a timing device that measures to about 10.000th of a second
What you cant do is have concept that is fatally flawed from the onset
how fast do you think andy green would have gone if he,d tried thrust ssc on a cobbled street with level crossings on it
i am not mocking what Top gear /scalex did but while scalextric track may be suitable for 20-30 mph when you have got the potential to do 150-200 mph you need to get it right at first base otherwise you will end up with egg on your face. Just because you can doesn,t mean that you should .

Cheers tony
 
#22 ·
Tony,

You are right that the track is paramount. But the logistics do start to get complicated. For a 350 foot track, that is 44 sections, each 8 feet long. If built from MDF, you could get, what, 6 or 7 pieces out of a single sheet? So, 7 or 8 sheets - not too bad. Routing and taping (?) is fairly inexpensive. But the sections need to be well braced for straightness and flatness and there needs to be a well designed interface between them. One of the best designs I have seen involved sidewalls of MDF routed lengthwise with a 1/2" relief to accept the 1/2" MDF track surface. But this obviously ups the MDF requirement by at least double. A connection system needs to be reliable and keep the sections perfectly aligned. Wiring is another issue as it is probable that each section will need to tap into a heavy cable running the entire length of the powered portion of the track. The actual venue is another issue as it needs 350 feet of perfectly flat area, or the track needs supports that are micro-adjustable. Building, storing, transporting, etc., are other issues.

Projects of this scope have been proposed many times. But it is the logistics of actually doing it that always seems to end the project before it leaves the drawing board.

Don't get me wrong! I think it would be great! But I've seen it several times before and it has never come to fruition. I hope this is the time that my "doubting side" has to eat crow!
 
#23 ·
QUOTE I know of a 24 hour race on a King track in 2005 where the winner covered 488.5 miles, which is a somewhat quicker average than the 1200 miles in 80 hours.
I would not doubt it!
Thing is, Champion did it without a motor, any motor parts OR TIRES changes! The ONLY part changed on the cars were guide contacts, a total of 5 pairs for 80 hours... That would be hard to beat, would it not?

As far as a 1/32 scale record, I have no clue of what is on the board, but we ran two Slot.It Porsche 956 bodies over two TSRF chassis about 2 years ago. This was set on an "automatic" Carrera oval track consisting two 15 feet straights linked by two # 4, 180-degree banked turns. Part of the rails were taped to slow the cars for the corners, so no control was used, the power was fed directly onto the track. The cars simply coasted into the banking when they hit the black electrical tape. Both cars ran side-by-side for 24 hours and covered a distance of 190.5 miles. They never hit each other in the banking despite some drifting. The braided contacts survived for 24 hours as well as the motors, but 4 sets of front tires were used as well as 2 sets of rear tires.
After that, one of the two cars ran another 24 hours, with the motor still showing little sign of slowing down. Another 2 sets of fronts and one change of rear tires was needed. Still no braided contacts change, it simply was never needed.
This was strictly an in-house test but it would be fun to replicate publicly and using dynamic brakes, maybe on a more interesting track...
I am game for some kind of record setting, but why eliminating the 1/24 scale cars? I mean there are quite a few on the market at this time and if anything that market IS growing.
Regards,

Philippe
 
#24 ·
Hi Fergy
Thanks for that ,With which I agree entirely
since there seems to be a little energy regarding this again (I have been talking with Chris Frost and Steve francis behind the scenes here ) but we,ll perhaps have a little go at seeing if there is anyone out there prepared to provide premises and access for a weekned and if that looks possible I might sit down for a few hours and do sum designing and accurate costing

Thern perhaps just prehaps it might finally happen ,I wonder if Top gear would be interested in doing it properly ?

Hamster are you out there ,this is safer than Jet cars !


Cheers tony
 
#25 · (Edited by Moderator)
Super
I would like to join your venture as I said earlier, but would you please be more specific regarding speed, would it be scale, or actual?, and what would the car spec be, what controllers would be used, and what power supply. then you would have to get in touch with Guiness book of records to have it verified, as well as asking them if they have any records in place, I think there is but it is very much out of date.

There are so many classes, and unfortunatley so many makers of hard bodied slot cars, that you are going to have a hard job with this, and I will help as much as I can, whilst wishing all the best luck in the world to achive what you want, there will always be someone who can do it better, but couldn't be bothered

Sincerely

Zen

 
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