ESDU rules Options

[Osku]

Hi Markus,

Like Fred said, suggestions and opinions are always welcomed.
However, I think we (the officials) will first vote on proposals made during EC in France.
I will post those proposals and results from voting here as soon as they are ready. We will have to figure out some details first.

I will keep your suggestions in mind and we will discuss that and some other things later.

Cheers and thanks,
Osku

[slotdragster]

I see a potential problem/conflict in the Gp20 classes, all other (weight related) suggestions aside:
The MM/PS and Gp20 (120/125g) classes are pretty similar to each other, but while you can integrate MM/PS into the ESDU Gp20 class, it's a bit harder the other way around.
I don't see a need to run both at 120g at the same event, and absolutely oppose replacing the existing Gp20 with MM/PS, since that would automatically scratch all Gp20 (hardbody) cars that don't fit the MM/PS discription from competition.
I can understand the wish for building and racing MM/PS cars to compare to the US results, but isn't that also possible within a 120g Gp20 class open to all other body styles? To run both, MM/PS and the trad. Gp20, it would probably make sense to leave Gp20 at 125g, or lower the weight to 120 and run your MM/PS cars within it.

Creating an additional 90g class would move most of the Lexan cars away from 125/120, leaving us with one HB and one lightweight class in Gp20.


BTW - I am not whining about "doorstops" - I don't mind running against them, since I was somewhat involved in allowing them in the first place - I just think they look ugly!

Regards,
Kescha

[Mahill]

It seems most of us want for next season a Gr20 90g lexan class that will be our very first affordable fast class, big step ahead for the hobby in Europe whose main problem was overweight slowed the cars.

Top Fuel Dragster and MM/PS are both Gr20 powered at 120g, similar performances but fantastic personalities, no need to change any rules there.

We don't need a 4th Gr20 class so the picture is clear, best future home for Gr20 Hardbodies could be Gr12 or a lexan body, not a big deal considering the gains.

Cheers

Fred

[Osku]

The problem with running (US rule comparable) MM/PS cars with other G20's is the mandatory inline chassis and .500 tires. A big disadvantage, just look at the numbers MM/PS and G20's were running in France. G20's were way faster even with 125g. weight.

Cheers,
Osku

[slotdragster]

Hi Osku,

I am sorry, but I am not convinced that MM/PS is that much slower, if at all, then a sidewinder/narrow tire Gp20.

Whatever the reasons were for the performance difference at the last race, there were plenty of races with no obvious advantage either way.
A quick look at the record board of the TR Motorplex track actually shows a quicker time and faster speed for the MM/PS class over HB/PS - both at 120g.

Even though MM/PS is probably run way more often then HB/PS, guys like Joe Bohannon should be able to get the best out of both combinations.

Narrow tires in (hb) Gp20 are hard to glue consistently, I am not saying that .500 wide is not overkill, but it shouldn't hurt your times much, unless there is way too much glue on the track.

The question for the ESDU should be: "Do we get more racers this way, or the other?" You could lose a few by becoming more restrictive and would gain absolutely nothing.

Regards,
Kescha

[Mahill]

MM/PS is by very far the most popular heads-up class in the US, been like that for 5 or 6 years so the top guys keep working on their cars and put in their best motors, if HB/PS which is sidewinder with similar bodies 120g was as popular, track records would be faster than those of MM/PS, just logics.

ESDU will win a lot of racers from the 90g/lexan/Gr20 class, this will be the natural Gr20 class, MM/PS & TFD will go on having less entrants but such personality that they'll have followers

Cheers
Fred

[Osku]

Hi Kescha,

Actually the difference between ET's surprised me a little bit in France, so I'm willing to take back my word "big" .
But I still think .500 tires & mandatory inline is a disadvantage.
US guys have been finetuning their MM/PS cars for how long... ten years ? I think that explains a lot.

In my opinion, if we (who ever the "we" are in this case) want to introduce MM/PS in Europe and make it grow, it should be a separate and an official class. Otherwise those cars will just disappear sooner or later.

I am not convinced at all that more strict rules prevents us (ESDU) getting more racers in the future. I know guys here who think ESDU rulebook is a joke because of the non-existing bodyrules. I don't agree with them but that was an honest opinion I got when I asked for it.
I respect your opinions but I really don't agree when you say we would gain absolutely nothing with more restrictive rules.

Regards,
Osku

[Dragaddict]

Hiya all After all the hard work for this race (which was great ) both me and my wife (especially) deserved a good holiday. First what I would like to say is that the level of racing is getting much higher for all of us and the most important thing is to have a crystal clear rulebook so that all participants can prepare their cars much better. Also as we discussed in the meeting we must adopt a a standard racing programme which shall be used for all the ESDU races. Scruttineering is also very important so that everyone will have the cars within rules. It was mentioned that none of the two ESDU races weren't on scheduled time because of some problems that arised ( BTW we're still learning ) my suggestion to solve the time schedule is to make the races on a four day period instead of three and race two classes per day, keeping a 32 car limit in all classes and racing with a best of three ladder. Now about the classes, I agree to drop the theme class and instead we introduce the MM/PS class as an official class. Regarding weight I also suggest that all the classes become 120 Grms except the Grp.20 which shall become a 90 Grm. class and allow lexan bodies for this class ( even door stoppers, which were mostly top qualifiers ).

[Dragaddict]

Hi, I would like to add that these proposals have been discussed between me and Charles and we both agreed with them. Also regarding the Grp.20 class bodies, I said that lexan should be allowed, actually it is already allowed.

[Steve D]

Hi all, are we still waiting for the new proposals to be published on here?

Or am I missing something?

Cheers

Steve D

[Osku]

Hi Steve,

No, you are not missing anything. I'm waiting for more replys concerning possible new officials before we get to proposals voting.

Did you get my email about it ?
If not, could you PM me your correct email address.

Thanks,
Osku

[Markus Reichl]

... concerning possible new officials ...

Talking about me???

Markus

[Osku]

Hi Markus,

Sorry, not at this time. Nothing personal of course.
There's no official rule about it but so far we have invited new officials only after we have met them and raced with them.

Regards,
Osku

[Markus Reichl]

Markus

[Markus Reichl]

No prob, Osku, I was just fantasizing ...

As long as my opinions are welcome I will continue posting them, anyway.

Slot Drag Racing will be my second slotracing leg for the future (with Wings being the other one with also the Worlds in Yurrup in 2011, so the 2011 emphasis will be there) and therefore ESDU 2012 will be right in time for me.

Fleet of cars is growing so I´ll be prepared at least then.

And I´m still dreaming of a Blueking and a dragstrip in Bavaria.

You´ll never know.

Good luck for the decisions for the future. I hope that these decisions will be blessed with a spirit which encourages new racers in the UK, Germany and other countries to begin building cars - and tracks, Inshallah. Don´t leave the car modellers out. Many 1:1 drag racers are more into hardbodies because they better resemble de reeel ting.

Cheers,

Markus