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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Found a site a few years back describing how a W109 Benz sedan driven by an inebriated Klaus Pach joined in the 1970 LeMans 24 Hr and wondered if the story is true. Anyone know for sure?.
If so, does anyone know where I can get a W109 (or W108) body, I reckon it'd suit my style perfectly.

The story is still on the web here
 

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My guess is that the photo is a fake, even if the story is true.

It looks like the Mercedes is alongside a Chaparral 2D which would be 4 years before the Mercedes was built.

Good story though.

Regards

Geoff
 

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QUOTE (AussieCapri @ 15 Oct 2004, 05:03)Found a site a few years back describing how a W109 Benz sedan driven by an inebriated Klaus Pach joined in the 1970 LeMans 24 Hr and wondered if the story is true. Anyone know for sure?.
If so, does anyone know where I can get a W109 (or W108) body, I reckon it'd suit my style perfectly.

The story is still on the web here
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

The complete list of entries at 1970 Le Mans 24 Hours is on: Le Mans Register - 1970 perhaps you should contact it to update the information.

Thee article on your link it's a really fun story.
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
QUOTE My guess is that the photo is a fake, even if the story is true. It looks like the Mercedes is alongside a Chaparral 2D which would be 4 years before the Mercedes was built.

The cars do look a bit earlier than 1970 and he mentions GT40s which I don't think ran that year.

I really, really want the story to be true but I think it'd be a really well known anecdote.

Ar well, it's up to our Euro friends to match the deed.
 

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Mooster the wet blanket here....yep, sorry guys, that's a pic of the 1966 race, which does kind of ruin the story a bit. There probably were a number of drunken Merc drivers about that year, but none of them got out onto the track, it seems.

Sorry about that.

Mooster
 

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A 6.3 never ran at Le Mans. Actually the first time a MB 6.3 ever ran in a race was at the Spa 24-hour in 1970, and this launched the AMG business. You can see a very interesting but brief history right here.
Regards,

Doc Pea
(AMG freak, "Death to M3's")
 

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It would be impossible for that Mercedes to keep up with GT40's as aerodynamics would play a big part as would weight. A very unrealistic story. Besides, a pace car would probably been put out and the respective flag waved for no overtaking and slow speed driving. The car would then have been immediately taken off track.
 

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QUOTE It would be impossible for that Mercedes to keep up with GT40's as aerodynamics would play a big part as would weight.

Yes of course, but the car nearly won the 24-hour race at Spa averaging only 8mph less than the Gulf-Mirage GT40 which won the race in 1968...

"In 1971, AMG - the performance tuning company specializing in Mercedes-Benz - succeeded in developing 428 hp from an increased engine bore of 6.8 liter together with other highly efficient refinements. AMG unflinchingly entered their missile - fitted with appropriate racing tires - for the 24-hour touring car race at Spa-Francorchamps. Only a works Ford Capri beat them to the finish."

Might be a brick but a fast brick. They lost 1st place only because they had to change too many tires... the car was nearly stock except for the enlarged engine and everything they could legally remove from the car to save weight.

Doc Pea
 

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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
There are some good stories on the W109 6.3 300 SEL-including three written by Jerry Sloniger on the one that started the 6526-strong model run, Erich Waxenberger's 6.3 and 6.8ltr racing weapons Here.

The racing specials aren't the ones referred to in the Bill Schaible Le Mans story though.
I'm resigned to the fact that Schlaible's story might be an, er, exageration but, even so, the real story behind the birth of the 6.3 300 SEL is quite fascinating.



I want (a little) one!
 

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QUOTE (AussieCapri @ 29 Oct 2004, 05:05)There are some good stories on the W109 6.3 300 SEL-including three written by Jerry Sloniger on the one that started the 6526-strong model run, Erich Waxenberger's 6.3 and 6.8ltr racing weapons Here.

The racing specials aren't the ones referred to in the Bill Schaible Le Mans story though.
I'm resigned to the fact that Schlaible's story might be an, er, exageration but, even so, the real story behind the birth of the 6.3 300 SEL is quite fascinating.



I want (a little) one!
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

You should look at MERCEDES AMG 300 SEL 6,3 DE 1972, seguimos de nuevo¡¡¡.... on DOC SLOT FORO DE S&B a spanish usergoup of Slot S&Builders. And you'll be urprised.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thnx Howmet, but the credit surely lies with Messrs Schaible, Sloniger, Uhlenhaut unt Waxenberger (in reverse order).

¡Gracias Delfi, usted han hecho mi día! (excuse Google translation)... And how much of a debt of gratitude do all us slot car junkies around the world owe to all our Spanish friends, I wonder?
 

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Phillipe
I not trying to be a smart alec. But if it was the 1968 race the winner was not a Mirage but P1075 the Gulf entered Ford GT40. If it was the Mirage M1 your referring to that was the 1967 Spa race and if this is the race the weather conditions would explain the time difference. As well as the 6.3, I have seen pictures of the Mercedes Benz 600 Pullman racing!!!
Regards Allan
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
QUOTE I have seen pictures of the Mercedes Benz 600 Pullman racing!!!

Beterer and beterer! Pics please Allan.

They say it was tyre chunking that brought the 300s undone. Dunno about that, considering the rather sedate cornering attitude evident in the photo
.
 

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I know I've seen them but where is the question? I might be wrong about the model but it would have to be the SWB. I am pretty sure it was in England.
Regards Allan
 

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QUOTE If it was the Mirage M1 your referring to that was the 1967 Spa race and if this is the race the weather conditions would explain the time difference.

Yes it was, and it rained really hard during nearly the whole 1970 touring car race...
Point is, a GT40 would reach about 180-185MPH in Masta, and the AMG-SEL was doing 175-plus... aerodynamics or not. The difference was in DRAG and down force. Where the SEL was literally flying with a lot less aero resistance than its shape would belie (it is SEPARATION that counts most, not air penetration), the GT40 was more nailed to the ground and causing air trouble behind itself, costing it top speed. The Gurney lip had not been invented yet. At Spa, cornering speed was not really a problem since nearly all except la Source was flat-out then...
Here is the best link for the Erich Waxenberger story: Click HERE.
Regards,

Doc Pea
 

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The text states the 6.3 raced in 1970 at Spa was this a saloon car race? Or that car would of be racing 917 Porsches!! I am getting confused???
 

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QUOTE I thought that the M1 Mirage was more aerodynamic than the GT40. Plus one other factor Jacky Icx!

It's Jacky ICKX...

Indeed the CD of the SEL is actually lower than that of the GT40, because of the drag caused by the down force applied through the shape of the car. While the GT40 has a lower static CX, once moving its drag increases. The SEL's shape was also wind-tunnel shaped, but to obtain the lowest CD as possible at the time. Of course it has virtually zero down force, and in fact a slight lift. It means that it can attain the same speed as the GT40 with less power. However the cornering speed is MUCH lower, and the only reason why it did so well at Spa was because cornering there is not really a factor as long as you don't mind sliding on all four at high speed. Hans Heyer did not mind, even in the rain, but the tires did and they had to change them almost every hour on the hour... The time spent doing this lost them the race, as they were (by far) the fastest car on the course for all 24 hours.

QUOTE The text states the 6.3 raced in 1970 at Spa was this a saloon car race? Or that car would of be racing 917 Porsches!! I am getting confused???

You are indeed. Every year since seemingly forever, Spa has had SEVERAL 24-hour races for touring, modified touring and also GT cars, besides the well-known sports-prototype 1000KMS race. They actually bring a lot more spectators than the FIA races. Today they even have a 24-hour race for... Citroen 2CVs and variants. Seeing a "hot" 2CV flat-out in l'Eau Rouge is pathetic, it feels like the yellow is on for the whole race. The funniest thing is to see the drivers equiped like if they just stepped out of the Bentley LMP... I went faster there in 1968 with a works 50cc Derbi GP, with only 3.2CI.!
 
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