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Discussion Starter · #61 ·
I'm pleased to say that Don Siegel 'dgersh' and Joel Thura 'merkit the grof' have kindly agreed to join me in Controle Technique - scrutineering in English - at Champagne Mouton this year.

I have put the regs. into English, just needing to write them up here. Hopefully later today. I lost a couple of days after the kitten walked over the keyboard then sat on it, freezing the laptop...

The votes on 'silicones or not' are in, unanimously in favour of banning them. I have a post from Jean-Mi on CSRC's Facebook page to answer about the tyre question; my reply will include these results.

Richard
 

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Discussion Starter · #63 ·
Here are the Tech. Regs. with a Programme of events, translated from Confolens SRC's Facebook page. They are available as a Microsoft document on request to me at [email protected]

Richard


Technical Regulations for the Confolens Classic 2022 at Champagne Mouton

For all races: Pre-1970 parts
. No modern parts except for replacement tyres and braids.

The track will be divided into 100 parts to avoid the frustration of finishing just before the lap counter but only being credited with the previous full lap.

Entry number limit: 30. Entries to Jean-Michel Germaneau by 15 September.

The bonus point returns for drivers taking the start with their own car.

Scalextric Power Sledge: 1:32 scale race for completely standard cars; nothing can be changed except the tyres and braids. Car catalogue numbers C5 Europa Vee, C6 Panther, C8 Lotus Indianapolis, C9 Ferrari V8 F1, C14 Matra MS11.

Thingies: 1:24 scale
standard commercially available catalogue cars with the chassis corresponding to the body. (I have a list. Richard).

Sports/GT: 1:32 and 1:24 scale, standard commercially available catalogue cars. Motor, chassis and guide non-modified original parts. The transmission can be from a different manufacturer e.g. a Cox crown gear in a Monogram car. No open-wheeled cars e.g. F1.

Revell: 1:32 scale. As last year, 'first generation' kits and Ready To Runs (RTRs) i.e. Chevrolet Corvette Stingray, Ferrari 250GTO, Aston Martin DB5, Mercedes 300SL, AC Cobra, Jaguar E-Type. (Note that no mention is made of the UK-only Triumph TR4 and Sunbeam Alpine RTRs, but I can't imagine anyone risking racing these rarities. Richard).
  • No modifications allowed.
  • Revell SP500 motor only. No SP510X, or open-frame Revell-Pittman RP77.
  • Chassis: original aluminium one-piece RTR or 'ladder' kit.

  • Wheels: standard.

  • Transmission: free choice but pre-1970 parts.
  • Guide: free choice but pre-1970 parts.
Scratchbuilt: 1:32 and 1:24 scale. No F1 i.e. open-wheeled cars. Repro and vacform bodies are allowed. Chassis can be homemade.


Programme

Saturday 24 September

  • 9h/14h : free practice.
  • 14h00 : SCALEXTRIC POWER SLEDGE race.
  • 15h30 : SPORTS/GT 1:32 STANDARD race.
  • 17h00 : SCRATCHBUILT 1:32 race.
  • 18h30 : REVELL 1:32 race.
  • 20h00 : Evening meal (with entertainment to be decided).


Sunday 25 September
  • 8h00 : Clubroom opens.
  • 9h00 : SPORTS/GT 1:24 STANDARD race.
  • 10h30 : THINGIES 1:24
  • 12h00 : Lunch.
  • 13h00 : SCRATCHBUILT 1:24 race.
  • 14h30 : Results and prizegiving.

(Note that Sunday's programme will change if it is decided that silicone tyres are allowed in the Thingies race. It will become the last race, preceded by practice which will be prohibited beforehand. Richard).
 

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Thanks for posting this Richard ,
A couple of points:
1/ Would you be comfortable posting the list of permitted cars for the Thingy race ? If not could you send a copy to me please.
2/ Judging by the last paragraph It seems that the silicone decision for the thingy race is still not final, either way. If silicones are to be allowed, can this be announced well ahead of the event, not on the weekend of the event.?- thus allowing time to find silicone tyres.
I only have urethane tyres and I suspect this maybe the case for others. (I think if silicones are allowed then all entrants will have to run them, to avoid the problem of running urethanes in lanes previously occupied by silicone cars)
I am pleased the power sledge race has not been bumped, having just bought a couple of cars. The race will be like the french trotting races, were galloping is banned - slow but good fun!
 

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Discussion Starter · #67 ·
Thanks for posting this Richard ,
A couple of points:
1/ Would you be comfortable posting the list of permitted cars for the Thingy race ? If not could you send a copy to me please.
2/ Judging by the last paragraph It seems that the silicone decision for the thingy race is still not final, either way. If silicones are to be allowed, can this be announced well ahead of the event, not on the weekend of the event.?- thus allowing time to find silicone tyres.
I only have urethane tyres and I suspect this maybe the case for others. (I think if silicones are allowed then all entrants will have to run them, to avoid the problem of running urethanes in lanes previously occupied by silicone cars)
I am pleased the power sledge race has not been bumped, having just bought a couple of cars. The race will be like the french trotting races, were galloping is banned - slow but good fun!
'morning Ian. What a beautiful morning here in Charente Limousine and sud Vienne isn't it? Albeit parky until the sun rises higher.

To answer your three points:
1. Yes can do. At the moment it lists only American Thingies, based on previous threads on the Forum. I have a bit more research to do to include Italian ones.

2. Announcement made by Jean-Mi on CSRC's FB page last night. I'm about to put it in the next post here. My thoughts are the same as yours and I made this point as an aside on FB earlier yesterday; that to stand a chance in the Thingies race if silicones are allowed then you'd need to run them. You could borrow silicones from the likes of me, they never seem to wear out.

3. See the following post. In the meantime, don't forget that Bruno was asking last week what classes we'd like for the year-long Club Championships. I suggest we ask to include Powersledges, once fettled and tyred. Nice analogy about trotting races! They can't be as bad as those ancient Scalextric BRMs with the pin guide...

Richard
 

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Discussion Starter · #68 ·
Gents, bearing in mind that it had been mooted above - by Don initially I think - that a compromise would be silicone tyres for the last to race Thingies only, Jean-Mi asked that we relent a bit from the 'no silicones at all' position. That's what's been agreed later yesterday (and after I posted the translation of the regs. as they stood before). All other classes are rubber/urethane tyres only.

With a prime concern being that the programme is not so crowded that the limited number of Confolens members can't enjoy themselves racing as well as organising and helping, the Powersledge race has been cancelled. I can well imagine, though, that they will be raced in a future year in the same way that Jean-Mi has mentioned that the old Scalextric Sports/GTs from the endurance race may be seen again - but not this year.

Thus there is some juggling to do on race order and times, but in former years it's been 1:32 race day Saturday and the bigger scale Sunday. What is definite is that Thingies on their silicones will not be allowed on track, even for practice, at any time before Sunday afternoon.

Taking the Powersledges out of the programme and tweaking it on the tyres, means that the Tech. Regs. and classes are now:

Technical Regulations for the Confolens Classic 2022 at Champagne Mouton

For all races: Pre-1970 parts
. No modern parts except for replacement tyres and braids.

The track will be divided into 100 parts to avoid the frustration of finishing just before the lap counter but only being credited with the previous full lap.

Entry number limit: 30. Entries to Jean-Michel Germaneau by 15 September.

The bonus point returns for drivers taking the start with their own car.

Thingies: 1:24 scale standard commercially available catalogue cars with the chassis corresponding to the body. Silicone tyres are permitted in this class only. No Thingies practice is permitted until Sunday afternoon i.e. until all other classes on their rubber/urethane tyres have practised and raced. (I have a list of Thingies. Richard).

Sports/GT: 1:32 and 1:24 scale, standard commercially available catalogue cars. Motor, chassis and guide non-modified original parts. The transmission can be from a different manufacturer e.g. a Cox crown gear in a Monogram car. No open-wheeled cars e.g. F1. Rubber/urethane tyres only.

Revell: 1:32 scale. As last year, 'first generation' kits and Ready To Runs (RTRs) i.e. Chevrolet Corvette Stingray, Ferrari 250GTO, Aston Martin DB5, Mercedes 300SL, AC Cobra, Jaguar E-Type. (Note that no mention is made of the UK-only Triumph TR4 and Sunbeam Alpine RTRs, but I can't imagine anyone risking racing these rarities. Richard).
  • No modifications allowed.
  • Revell SP500 motor only. No SP510X, or open-frame Revell-Pittman RP77.
  • Chassis: original aluminium one-piece RTR or 'ladder' kit.
  • Wheels: standard.
  • Tyres: Rubber/urethane only.
  • Transmission: free choice but pre-1970 parts.
  • Guide: free choice but pre-1970 parts.
Scratchbuilt: 1:32 and 1:24 scale. No F1 i.e. open-wheeled cars. Repro and vacform bodies are allowed. Chassis can be homemade. Rubber/urethane tyres only.

25 January 2022 replacing older versions.​
 

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Thanks Richard.
I know it is not easy acting as the translator and go between for anglo/french relations for the event - and I know it is appreciated by many.

(In fact I think you should be allowed to run your cars with "CD" plates on them to reflect your diplomacy skills !)
 

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What is the thing with Thingies and silicones?
Most of them were supplied new with sponge tyres so why not run them on those?, why silicones?
As long as you bring the car to the track with dry tyres there would be no problems, you treat them the same way as 'rubber' tyres and these are allowed in in other races.

I have no idea where the rules for this event are coming from!
 

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Well I can't say I am not disappointed...just got the Revell's running well!
Are there any modifications allowed to the cars apart from new tyres?

I suspect that there may be a strong smell of burnt motors on that long straight!
Anyone need a RX motor re-zapped?!

Mark
Hi Mark
I was just passing time scrolling through this thread and your post caught my eye.
What is "re-zapping", how is it done and what is the benefit?
( I know the powersledge class is now dropped but I bought some cars, hoping to make one good one. On 3 cars the rpm at the rear wheels varied from 6k to 8.4k - a big difference)
Just curious!
Thanks
Ian
 

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Hi Ian,
Zapping is re-magnetising. The open frame motors in particular lose magnetism over time, so re-magnetising should increase power, brakes and help the motor run cooler. I zapped the Powersledge motor that I had bought for September and it made a noticeable difference to top speed, acceleration and braking. However, all things are relative and it is still a Powersledge with all the performance you would expect!
Zapping Pittman, Atlas and MRRC motors will make a big difference if the magnets are a bit tired though.
Mark
 

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Discussion Starter · #73 ·
Bonjour,

The question has been asked about vacform bodies in the two standard Sports/GT classes. i.e. if the catalogue car came with a vacform body, is it eligible or are these classes restricted to hard bodies? The examples given were the Russkit Porsche Carrera 6 (906) in 1:24 and Riko in the smaller scale.

I referred this to le chef. Jean-Mi was not familiar with Riko, for example, but was happy to take my word for it that certain 'catalogue' cars came with vacform bodies as standard and are therefore allowed.

If you are tempted by 1:32 Riko, though, don't forget that not all are from the 1960s. 'Competition' (Rikochet motor), 'Super' (Rikowhip) and 'Trophy' (Rikowhip again) Series were all out before or by the autumn of 1969. These three are thus eligible. The 'Sideliner' anglewinder didn't appear until the early autumn of 1970 and the 'orrible but common GXL - Riko Rocket motor in the Competition chassis with cheapo alloy mounts to take a 'handling' body - is from '73 from memory. They are NOT eligible.

I have lists of which bodies came with which Riko kits, if needed.

Cheers, Richard.
 

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I think you've opened a can of worms there Richard & Jean-Mi.

I like vac-form cars, but think that the standard sports/GT class should be restricted to hard bodies - mostly to avoid an arms race (believe me, we know about that at Bordo).

There's not always a huge difference, but in some cases yes! For instance, the Russkit Ferrari 350 I ran in the scratch category the last two years, winning one, and finishing among the leaders in the other, is a standard Russkit car; and I believe any of the Russkit Carrera sidewinder cars in 1/24 would run rings around the others - as would a well prepared Riko car in 1/32, even one of the earlier ones, and perhaps one of the Cox 1/32 Daytona series cars as well. There are a lot of vac-form bodied cars in 1/24, and while some may not have much of an advantage, you're also opening that to cars like Champion, with rewound motors, and various cars with 26D motors.

To me, it seems simpler and fairer to restrict these classes to the "classic" hard bodied cars.

Please double check this with Jean-Mi.

Respectfully yours
Don
 

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Hi Ian,
Zapping is re-magnetising. The open frame motors in particular lose magnetism over time, so re-magnetising should increase power, brakes and help the motor run cooler. I zapped the Powersledge motor that I had bought for September and it made a noticeable difference to top speed, acceleration and braking. However, all things are relative and it is still a Powersledge with all the performance you would expect!
Zapping Pittman, Atlas and MRRC motors will make a big difference if the magnets are a bit tired though.
Mark
If no access to rezzapping does adding extra ones work?
For home use.
Cheers,
John.
 

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I agree with Don's sentiments.
There is plenty of opportunity to use vac form bodies in the scratch built classes. I think you will get closer racing by restricting the standard class to hard bodies models and avoid any arguments over rule interpretation.......and there are lots of hard body models to choose from in both scales.
Mark
 

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John,
In theory adding magnets should make a difference, but in my experience it is not as effective as zapping. It would be better to replace the old magnet with a neo magnet, but if you are running your open frame motors on plastic track the neo magnets might be too strong, i.e. too much magnatraction.
Mark
 

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Slot King
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I am with Don on the hard body thing, "standard cars should have a lower level of performance than the scratchbuilt classes.
For example this Dynamic Ferrari is "standard", yet it is the exact receipt I use for my scratchbuilt car, vac body and 26D.
Wheel Motor vehicle Hood Toy Tire



There are others such as this one, vac body and 26D
Vehicle Car Automotive lighting Hood Motor vehicle



Fleischman Lotus 40, and a number of vac bodied Carrera using the race chassis with 26D spring to mind, there must be plenty more
I won't tell you the potential candidates in 1/32nd in case I end up using one of them ;).


Joel
 

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I asked Richard the question but I agree with the views above.
Better to keep the vac forms to the scratchbuilt class and make the 'production' Sports/GT class, 1/32 and 1/24, hard bodied would be my vote.
 

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Discussion Starter · #80 ·
Gents, on the question of vacform bodies in the standard class, Jean-Mi and I discussed it briefly at Champagne Mouton clubnight yesterday. Confolens SRC is sticking with its decision i.e. if your catalogue car came with a vacform as standard, you can run it.

For me, the question is one of how to get however much power you have to the track. Grip can be so poor on the Green Monster on rubber/urethane that a screamer of a motor in a light chassis is more of a hindrance than an advantage. The pans on my Russkit Porsche 906 are full of lead... daft! But then these and many other cars by 1965 or so were intended for gooped sponge tyres. Come to that, the track surface paint on the Green Monster and Bordeaux' AMF track is meant for gooped sponge - but for reasons I don't know, even less understand, nowhere in France as far as I am aware runs treated sponge tyres.

Richard
 
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