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Living the Life!
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QUOTE I never wat to go back to wired throttles agian...
Another convert .........
I refer you to post #23 in this thread .....
 

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Living the Life!
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You know what Brian? ............ that is a jolly good idea. This will be my first drink since .............................. the last one - blimey that's six days ago. It's amazing how much fun you can have testing and testing and testing and .................. zzzzzzzz
 

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QUOTE (RichG @ 18 Apr 2012, 05:18) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>So this will probably not keep anyone happy, but I consider it to be a good easy to use & understand minimum configuration.

Rich

It would be enough to keep me happy. I'm looking for an easy, clearly visible, minimum option means of displaying exactly the information you outline. I am regularly running events for primary school children who are interested in who won, and who was fastest. When I race with adults or older teens then options such as fuel, pitting etc become more valuable but SSDC meets these requirements well
 

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Hi Dreamer .......... with out stealing Rich's thunder, I would say that Display-Pro will easily meet your requirements and some.
 

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The latest update on testing is really rather boring ........ it is now just a matter of trying to find any little oddities hiding away in the periphery!
 

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Boring is good.


I have now moved my attention to wireless throttles. The current release supports Scorpius throttles, although it is not tested as to how well it will cope with 6 throttles?

I am in the process of understanding and coming up with a way of supporting oXigen throttles. They use a far more complex protocol than Scorpius and although I can receive data from them I have not fully mastered the pairing process. However the plan once I have done this and understand both protocols, is to best decide what protocol to use for the RichG throttles?

The one I played with over Easter I programmed to look like a Scorpius throttle, so that was an easy short term solution, as I had one of each. I may do something similar for oXigen, but a lite version, perhaps without the pairing. But am not ready to decide yet.

Exactly what combinations of throttles will be able to be used simultaneously and exactly the process needed to setup for this is also undecided. I do not think that it will be possible to support Scorpius & oXigen throttles simultaneously, but I hope that I can support any mix of RichG & Scorpius or RichG & oXigen.

All fun stuff but it's going to take a while to come up with and code for the final solution.


Rich
 

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......... does this mean we get to test the wireless throttles as well ?????
 

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At some point there will be some alpha RichG throttles. Exactly when or how much they will cost is at the moment unknown, and yes they will be offered first to the alpha testers. I am well on the way but want to fully understand Scorpius & oXigen first. Both to learn about what works and what does not and also to come up with the best scheme to allow combinations of throttles to be used simultaneously.

My working assumption is that anyone who has a number of oXigen or Scorpius wireless throttles will be running Scorpius or oXigen in their cars. So my solution is primarily aimed at people that may have access to 1 or 2 Sc. or oX. throttles and want to use them in combination with some lower function, lower cost RichG or wired throttles on their SSD track.

My target is actually set higher than this and I would like to be able to run any mix of RichG & Scorpius or RichG and oXigen throttles. However it will only be testing that will prove if this is possible. The minimum target I have set is for obviously 6 RichG throttles, which is now proven, or 4 RichG throttles and either 2 Scorpius or 2 oXigen throttles.

The fundemental problem is that both Scorpius & oXigen are designed to work 1:1 Controller to Car. Typically this takes place with a different frequency allocated for each pair and as such they all coexist merrily exchanging data oblivious of eachother.

In my system there is a single receiver in Display-Pro that then needs to receive data from the 6 throttles. Fine for the RichG throttles because they can be designed to work in this mode. I have tried a couple of different protocols, both of which are fine.

Now looking at Scorpius in Scorpius mode this uses a different frequency for each throttle. So in this mode I would need to switch frequency and try to track when each throttle is transmitting in order to get data from the 6 throttles. Could work but there is some risk of transmissions being coincident and theirfore missed. Not a problem for a single transmission but if two throttles were in sync then you could only get data on alternate transmissions, which is probly still ok, because refresh is at 10mS intervals. Also need to plan for a throttle stopping transmission and then the need to find it again, whilst still receiving data from the other connected throttles.

Alternatively I could do what SSDC has done using the Scorpius Dongle. That is to put all the Scorpius throttles onto a single frequency and then use the Pin in the packet to differentiate between throttles. So easier in one respect because I just listen on a single frequency, however the coincident transmission problem is now made worse because the two throttles are on the same frequency and it's possible that both will be missed until the throttles drift apart in time. This would be unacceptable

oXigen because of it's more complex protocol both offers addional problems, but also potential solutions to the above problem. Each throttle transmits the same data on three different frequencies in a 30mS time slot. So some similar choices to Scorpius. Either run in oXigen mode with each throttle on a different triplet of frequencies or put all the throttles onto a single frequency triplet and rely on the built in MAC to differentiate between throttles.

Now the fact that there are 3 frequencies sent at different times to choose from for each throttle probably solves the overlapping throttle problem, but the algorithm to locate & track where the throttles are in frequency & time will be a bit complex. Also because new data is only sent at 30mS intervals missing ocassional packets is ok, but you could not work off alternate packets, as you could with Scorpius, if 2 throttles were transmitting in the same time slot. However oXigen throttles are also designed to exchange data with the O2_Chrono RMS and in order to do so Sync to Chrono. This offers a complex but interesting possible solution to timing in that Display-Pro could send out dummy Dongle packets and uses then to sync the throttles?

So enough of that but just wanted to share a flavour of what I am wading through to come up with an integrated solution, and to explain why it might take a while.


Rich
 

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While I wrestle with the protocol technicalities, which although important and interesting to me, will be completely hidden from the user. I would welcome inputs on the functional side of the wireless throttle
So keeping in mind that this is meant to be an easy to set up, easy to use system what are the adjustments that are the most important, and how might they be adjusted? If you want comprehensive and complex then go get a Scorpius or oXigen throttle.


So remembering that there is a processsor in there, which means that a control can have more than one function dependant on when, in what combination and for how long it is pressed.
What if there were just the two buttons, the throttle and a single additional rotary pot, what would you use them for?

The other factor to throw into the mix at this point is that the bulk of users will have standard and not MIH chips, the enhancements cannot be expected to be there.

So just as an example and to stimulate thinking. Throttle curve is a pretty standard function. In my limited use of the SCP-1 I found the Linear with step function brilliant at taming faster motors on a small track, however people also like a variety of curves. So suppose with the pot set in the middle you get a linear curve. Then rotating in one direction you get Linear with an increasing step. The in the other direction it introduces a curve. I am not certain which is the most useful way to have the curve bend?

If people have pictures of their favorite curves and why and when they use them, then post them up.

Final example is the brake button, not used by many but loved by some, so perhaps we need a way of changing it's function? However also remeber there is a processor so whatever it's function you can add a second function, as oXigen does, where a brief tap on the brake button toggles the lights on and off. Although as a reminder this function would only be available with the MIH chip.

So what's important to you, and how would you propose setting it?

Rich
 

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Hi all,

I'll get down to some serious testing tomorrow but as Greg & Brian seem to have been successful in finding the bugs there doesn't seem much wrong - in fact nothing yet

In the meantime here's some monitor comparability pics with four different monitors and the practice mode. Even the carpy 13 year old 15" CRT monitor looks good.


From top left clockwise: iiyama 19" CRT; Benq 17"4:3 LCD; Samsung 19" LCD TV/monitor 16:10; iiyama 15" CRT.

Both the CRT monitors have done a lifetime of intensive service and should have been thrown several years ago.

No problems or difficulties so far on a small simple oval track in both analogue and digital. It really is just plug and race - in mode 2, left arrow brings up practice mode, right arrow race mode, down arrow to ID cars (after I realised I should be looking at the PB lights and not the screen - yes I know I should have rtfm). No faffing around or complex setting up, just pull the trigger. It couldn't really be any simpler and so I hope this can be maintained as new features are added.

The remote works well from every point in the room, even from the ground floor doorway up to to the mezzanine some 8m away (and with the smaller aerial). The box has started up in both modes 1 & 2 first go every time in just a few seconds - would be nice to have a visible led though. Firmware updated without a hitch. So far it seems all laps are being recorded (with a nice subtle beep for the testing) and 6 cars nose to tail.

Cheers
Chris
 

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Hi Chris,
The only bit about ID'ing cars that I fell unsure about is when you press the ▼ then select the 1-6 with the ◄ and ► buttons and press Start, the Green & Red LEDs light up then, I find I need to press the Start button again and then finish off with the ▲ to return to either of the modes of Practice or Race.

Do you find this or is it just me?? My remote Fob does not always seem to work at 100% but the rest is just F.M.
 

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Hi Greg,

I think I only pressed the start button once and I thought only red or green was on but I'll have a closer look tomorrow.

Rich, I know it probably won't be necessary for 10 years but do you just prise the fob apart to change the battery?
Also, is it correct that the fob doesn't work in mode 1?
Lastly, is there a 2.1 sec minimum lap time programmed in mode 2 or does it get it from the PB setting?

Cheers
Chris
 

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Tomorrow is only 6 minutes away ........


To try and improve my fob I used a flat-bladed screwdriver to prise it apart and clean the contacts with no great dramas.
 

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Ok it's tomorrow now

Greg, I don't see the same as you.

In practice mode, just the green led on the PB is on - I press ▼ and ID#1 lights up - I then press ► till the ID# I want lights up - I press the middle (start) button once and the PB green led goes off & the PB red led comes on - I press ▲ to return to practice mode and the PB red led goes off and the PB green led comes back on ... et voila, the car has the new ID.
All these presses are on the fob (remote)

At no stage did I see the red & green leds on together. HTH.
 
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