A brilliant vid, Kev, which I've just watched from start to finish. Something for everyone in that extraordinary cavalcade. Thank you for posting it. Incidentally, unlike Eff 1, no one stopped for a £3,000 set of tyres, and I didn't see anyone yawning. A little slower than Eff 1, but much more enjoyable.
F1 - A general conversation
With all the subject matter being raised in the various F1 topics on here I thought I would start a general topic for any this not related to a particular race.
I came across this a few days ago
The 1965 Dutch GP.
And it just goes to show that some things haven't really changed. This race was just about halfway through the season and Clark is already just about confirmed as champion and the gaps between the leading cars at the end? Raymond Baxter calls this a close and exciting race, wonder what he would make of current F1 races?
This was Jim Clark's 5th win out of six races, he also won the next race in Germany. The only one of the first six races he didn't win he didn't take part in, Monaco, which was won by Graham Hill in a BRM who won the next two races after Germany with Jackie Stewart and the Hill again. Honda broke the mould with their first win in the final race in Mexico with Richie Ginter.
Championship :-
1st Jim Clark 54 Points (all his 6 points scores were wins and all counted, best 6 finishes only counted)
2nd Graham Hill 40 points
3rd Jackie Stewart 33 points
4th Dan Gurney 25 points
5th John Surtees 17 points
6th Lorenzo Bandini 13 points
7th Richie Ginther 11 points
8th Mike Spence & Bruce McLaren 10 points
another seven drivers scored points and after that another 24 drives competed in at lease one of the ten races that year.
That's 40 drivers competing in total and another 11 who attempted to qualify.
The Constructors championship was ( only the 1st placed car in each team counted)
1st Team Lotus - Lotus-Climax 54 points (Jim Clark, Mike Spence and two other drivers )
2nd Owen Racing Organisation - BRM 45 points (Graham Hill & Jackie Stewart)
3rd Brabham Racing Organisation - Brabham-Climax 27 points (Jack Brabham, Dan Gurney, Denny Hulme and 1 other driver)
4th Ferrari - Ferrari 26 points (Lorenzo Bandini, John Surtess (8 races), Pedro Rodriguez (2 races) and 3 other drivers)
5th Cooper Car Comapny - Cooper_Climax 14 points (Bruce McLaren and Jochen Rindt)
6th Honda R & D Company - Honda 11 points (Ronnie Bucknum & Richie Ginther)
7th RRC Walker Racing Team - Brabham-BRM 5 points (Jo Siffert also Jo Bonnier in a Brabham - Climax)
8th Reg Parnell Racing - Lotus--BRM 2 points Richard Attwood, Innes Ireland, Mike hailwood, Chris Amon and 2 other drivers)
with 3 other teams racing and another 3 teams that did not qualify for any races.
I came across this a few days ago
The 1965 Dutch GP.
And it just goes to show that some things haven't really changed. This race was just about halfway through the season and Clark is already just about confirmed as champion and the gaps between the leading cars at the end? Raymond Baxter calls this a close and exciting race, wonder what he would make of current F1 races?
This was Jim Clark's 5th win out of six races, he also won the next race in Germany. The only one of the first six races he didn't win he didn't take part in, Monaco, which was won by Graham Hill in a BRM who won the next two races after Germany with Jackie Stewart and the Hill again. Honda broke the mould with their first win in the final race in Mexico with Richie Ginter.
Championship :-
1st Jim Clark 54 Points (all his 6 points scores were wins and all counted, best 6 finishes only counted)
2nd Graham Hill 40 points
3rd Jackie Stewart 33 points
4th Dan Gurney 25 points
5th John Surtees 17 points
6th Lorenzo Bandini 13 points
7th Richie Ginther 11 points
8th Mike Spence & Bruce McLaren 10 points
another seven drivers scored points and after that another 24 drives competed in at lease one of the ten races that year.
That's 40 drivers competing in total and another 11 who attempted to qualify.
The Constructors championship was ( only the 1st placed car in each team counted)
1st Team Lotus - Lotus-Climax 54 points (Jim Clark, Mike Spence and two other drivers )
2nd Owen Racing Organisation - BRM 45 points (Graham Hill & Jackie Stewart)
3rd Brabham Racing Organisation - Brabham-Climax 27 points (Jack Brabham, Dan Gurney, Denny Hulme and 1 other driver)
4th Ferrari - Ferrari 26 points (Lorenzo Bandini, John Surtess (8 races), Pedro Rodriguez (2 races) and 3 other drivers)
5th Cooper Car Comapny - Cooper_Climax 14 points (Bruce McLaren and Jochen Rindt)
6th Honda R & D Company - Honda 11 points (Ronnie Bucknum & Richie Ginther)
7th RRC Walker Racing Team - Brabham-BRM 5 points (Jo Siffert also Jo Bonnier in a Brabham - Climax)
8th Reg Parnell Racing - Lotus--BRM 2 points Richard Attwood, Innes Ireland, Mike hailwood, Chris Amon and 2 other drivers)
with 3 other teams racing and another 3 teams that did not qualify for any races.
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I just watched it through also, only one Ferrari, 17 Citroens (mostly Dyanes) in a line near the end, old Volvos, American iron, early Jap cars (a couple of Truenos), '55 Chevy, Ladas, Mk1 Escorts, Mk3 Cortinas, Old Rollers, Minis, Beetles...too much to remember
I've seen some of the footage of the 30s, 50s and 60s races where one driver or team dominated the race and season.
How were they different from today's races please?
Just trying to understand what the fundamental differences people keep talking about are.
Andi
How were they different from today's races please?
Just trying to understand what the fundamental differences people keep talking about are.
Andi
Because they were better drivers back then so we keep getting told.I've seen some of the footage of the 30s, 50s and 60s races where one driver or team dominated the race and season.
How were they different from today's races please?
Lewis Hamilton publicly crticises Mercedes after the first race of the year. Next, he apologises to his team after a pow-wow at Bracknell. Today, the scribblers have quoted him as retracting his apology to the team! As well as this, he suddenly and unexpectedly splits from his personal trainer/physio/analyst/confidant during during a race weekend while saying that she is still his best friend. Methinks that he is not in a good place right now. I wonder how long he will be at Mercedes, although where is there for him to go?
Lewis Hamilton is not used to loose, that’s a complete new reality to him.
So now he is in denial and blames everyone/everything around him.
Nothing new, only human. He’ll land on his feet again, getting proper help. Maybe Angela is not the right person for this?
So now he is in denial and blames everyone/everything around him.
Nothing new, only human. He’ll land on his feet again, getting proper help. Maybe Angela is not the right person for this?
The Mayor of Atlantic City in Noo Joyzee has approved the 3 billion dollar development of a new F1 circuit on the site of a disused airfield.
I read/heard somewhere a quote attributed to Toto: "Angela is the only person in the team who is louder than an engine starting"Maybe Angela is not the right person for this?
I just thought it was funny.
Joel
Impossible to be sure, of course, but I suspect we are witnessing the decline of Lewis Hamilton. It's an inevitable part of someone who has been at the top for so long. He has lost none of his skill but, like many others before him, he is perhaps beginning to lose interest in his raison d'etre.
Maybe the hunger's gone, and why wouldn't it after seven Championship victories. He has enjoyed a glorious career, but maybe it's time to bow out gracefully, and make way for the younger generation, as Graham Hill eventually did.
Maybe the hunger's gone, and why wouldn't it after seven Championship victories. He has enjoyed a glorious career, but maybe it's time to bow out gracefully, and make way for the younger generation, as Graham Hill eventually did.
All change at McLaren, with updates due in a couple of races’ time after screwing up development over winter - fingers crossed they’ll help get them further up the grid 🤞
It's strange to me that McLaren's fortunes have changed so quickly, and so markedly. Lando, in particular was a regular top seven contender last season, yet is now floundering and struggling to stay in touch. However, with just over a second separating the front and rear of the grid, margins are becoming finer with little room for error.
I also continue to struggle to understand the reasons for the seemingly searing pace of Max's Red Bull, which is incomprehensibly so much faster than anything else I've ever seen previously. Surely it can't just be down to the design of the rear wing alone?
I also continue to struggle to understand the reasons for the seemingly searing pace of Max's Red Bull, which is incomprehensibly so much faster than anything else I've ever seen previously. Surely it can't just be down to the design of the rear wing alone?
I don’t know, Laurence 🤷♂️
Mind you, Mr.Newey’s a veritable genius.
Mind you, Mr.Newey’s a veritable genius.
He probably peaked two years ago, sadly it wasn't just the other drivers on the grid trying to beat him...Impossible to be sure, of course, but I suspect we are witnessing the decline of Lewis Hamilton. It's an inevitable part of someone who has been at the top for so long. He has lost none of his skill but, like many others before him, he is perhaps beginning to lose interest in his raison d'etre.
Maybe the hunger's gone, and why wouldn't it after seven Championship victories. He has enjoyed a glorious career, but maybe it's time to bow out gracefully, and make way for the younger generation, as Graham Hill eventually did.
That season ended any true interest in F1 for me as someone who's earliest memories include watching F1 Coopers on a little black and white telly in the very early 60's.
The next big regs change should be interesting but we'll have a long wait. If WEC is anything to go by I'm looking forward to it...maybe!
I thought Lewis said this was his last season?
Maybe I am wrong because all of a sudden I realized it has "0" impact on my life...
Maybe I am wrong because all of a sudden I realized it has "0" impact on my life...
Toto has said that they have two years, including this, to get thing right and be winning again or Lewis will have to consider leaving for a different team to get his eighth championship. Although he plays these things down I think he really, really, really wants that extra title and at the moment it's just the frustration of knowing there is almost zero chance this year showing through. He is after all just human like the rest of us.
He's never going to win another WDC...it's over for him now.
First of all you need the best car, that's been proved for decades, secondly you need to be the best of the two team drivers and I'm not sure he's even that any more.
First of all you need the best car, that's been proved for decades, secondly you need to be the best of the two team drivers and I'm not sure he's even that any more.
Other opinions are, of course, available...................... 
I'm first and foremost a realistOther opinions are, of course, available......................
All periods of dominance are finite, the other fly in the ointment for Lou Lou is that his team mate is pretty handy.
Cr 4 p as the Merc is ,it's still a massive step up for George compared to the Williams, saving grace of the season is probably the performance of the Green Bull, it's great to see Fernando in the mix, even Lancelot is improving.
Cr 4 p as the Merc is ,it's still a massive step up for George compared to the Williams, saving grace of the season is probably the performance of the Green Bull, it's great to see Fernando in the mix, even Lancelot is improving.
A Brazilian Court has given Nelson Piquet a fine of £781,000 for making racist comment about Lewis Hamilton. Piquet has a right to appeal.
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