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This is relevant to peace and harmony at Slotforum so it has to be relevant to slot cars. From a political standpoint it would probably be better for the moderators to stay silent as far as this topic goes.

This topic is to act as a magnet and hopefully should help to prevent the sort of side issues arrising in other threads that some folk find a bit upsetting.

Discussion in other topics seem to go off at a tangent because some members seem to feel that the language that I use suggests I am stating facts not opinions when some folk appear to want only opinions and not facts. So apologies if some folk take things the wrong way.

I am not sure if I am the only one guilty of this but it sometimes feels like it!


To prevent further threads turning to this type of debate and possibly spoiling the threads for others, what sort of language needs to use so prevent this?

Lets clear the air here and resolve how things should be said. Just to say that I would not normally reveal sources if I strongly believe something is relevant and needs to be said and I would not expect others to either. Lets make that point clear.

Lets have a friendly little discussion and not act like silly billies for once!


What words and language are acceptable to those members who feel the language needs to be modified and what words and language is not acceptable.

I do have a wider experiance than many folk here may believe and sometimes certain language may need to be used to wake people up and encourage discussion.

A forum does survive on its discussion after all.

Its nice to have news but how far can discussion go around a news story?

You can only read so many "wow that is nice" sort of threads before they all read the same.

We are all our own people and we all have our own way of saying things. In the same way we all have our own way of intepreting what is being said.

At the end of the day are we all adult enough to accept our different ways of saying things and putting points across?


Some folk seem to get frustrated when they don't receive a reply to points or issues raised by them. To those folk I would ask them to use humour rather than ill temper. You are more likely to get a response from me (if that is what you want) if you are humorous! Many of us visit Slotforum for the banter and if I get a laugh out of what I read then I am more likely to want to read more.

I can quickly get turned off by the opposite and if I do then no doubt others do to. I tend to ignore ill tempered folk where I can as they do not fit in with my outlook on life and possibly others feel the same way.

This is probably a "fact" of discussion board life.


And finally, I think it is so funny that toys can cause so much ill temper!


Its just like being in the school playground!



Moped
 

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It's rarely the 'toys ' that cause the irritation in a discussion.
The toys can't talk (or post).

Here is your own answer to that which you seem to find such an insurmountable difficulty.
QUOTE Language has to be clear else it is open to interpretation.
To which must be added that it's in both writer's and readers' interest, in fact ESSENTIAL to avoiding misunderstandings, that the writer makes it clear when a statement is personal opinion or purported fact. Some people appear to specialise in deliberately obfuscating this important issue.

Oh, and HUGE irritation is caused by presenting someone else's reported speech or text, often without any acknowlegement, as if it were one's own. It has been noted on occasion that such a 'pseudo quotation' has been at considerable variance with what had been originally said by the original source, having been cunningly or perhaps more charitably, carelessly, paraphrased to give a completely false impression to the original.

QUOTE Some folk seem to get frustrated when they don't receive a reply to points or issues raised by them.
Absolutely to be expected!
If someone makes wild claims, is asked to substantiate them and then pointedly and stubbornly avoids every relevant issue raised in response, it is absolutely natural that credibility and integrity will be under the deepest suspicion.
QUOTE I am not sure if I am the only one guilty of this but it sometimes feels like it!
Only sometimes?
Avoidance of clear issues always arouses suspicion from even the most reasonable of people.

But you KNOW all this, it having been said unnumerable times before, so I'm not sure why it poses such difficulty.
Well, actually, I am, but am too polite to say!
 

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I have been told to 'take a prozac' by lowrider (not misquoted, he actually mentioned prozac) when it comes to my responses to moped posts.

He goes... *gulp*...

My main issue is that moped (and sometimes others) state things like: 'This IS the ultimate challenge' or 'Home racers DON'T LIKE to tune cars'.

Obviously, we know what they mean, but it IS frustrating (for me at least) to hear this as others might not realise that they are exagerating and may take it as fact. I also don't like it when people talk for others, for example 'Juniors only like racing with magnets' particularly hacks me off because I am considered a junior by others, especially when I started, and it was NOT the case with me. No one can catagorise people and say that all of them enjoy one type of thing, or do one type of thing, because they cannot possibly know this, as everyones opinions differ.

I would just like to see more people reading through what they have just written before they post it. I'm pretty sure that almost everyone has said something and regretted it afterwards, so to stop this happening, just check what you have said before you have said it. Read the post, and if you think that people might not understand what you mean, clarify, or at least give some evidence. And above all make sure that your opinions are stated as such.

Another thing that frustrates me is when people tell others what they should be doing. Clearly, as everyones opinions differ, everyone will want to do different things. (Yes, I realise the irony that I am telling people to check their posts and things, but this is different. It's for the sake of the forum).

One more thing. People talking as if they know what they are talking about. If you have no experience in a particular field, would it not be better to ask questions and find out more about it, rather than guessing and getting shot down for getting it wrong.

That's about it... quite placid, eh?

*gulp, gulp* I could get quite used to this...

Lotus
 

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Scott Brownlee
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Two things spring to mind;

Say what you mean and mean what you say.

and,

Live never to be ashamed of what is said or written about you, even if what is said or written is not true.

Neither original (by me at any rate)

Scott
 

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Jamie Coles
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Two things that have always bugged me - probably from schoold debating society, but also thru the years with politicians and others who have their own agenda and do not wish to stary from it.

One is when a question is asked it really Pees me off if the answer has nothing to do with the question.

The second is if the subject is changed to something that can be more easily and less contoversially dealt with.

Hate to say it Moped but you fall into both camps.

This thread has come from a discussion about carrerra cars - through a discussion about rules, then whether people used box standard cars or not (and if they did then they prseumably lost). next thread was whether weight should be used and finally (so far) the topic is whether people want (one-sdied) opinions or facts during threads.

I've only been seriosuly contributing for a few weeks but aleady it would seem you are more than happy to start a controversial thread, yet as soon as it becoems undefendable you leave it alone and start asking the same questions in another.

One thing that concerns me - and I am sure I am not alone - you suggest there should be openess and ok you won't "reveal sources" - perhaps that is a good thing considerinmg some of the comments - but please give in once.

You have said that you have some knowledge about Ninco track set up - do us all a favour and in the openess of this forum let us all know then I for one will respect your posts more.
J-c
 

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Hi Moped,

as far as I'm concerned, I think you have quite weird opinions about slotcars (IMHO!), not to speak how much you lack of objectivity when Scalextric is in some way involved in the thread (IMHO!), but for sure I don't get irritation by your posts...
Well, if you'd be less "biblical" in your assertions and use more some standard conversation "tricks", as putting "IMHO" somewhere...



Ciao
Otello
 

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Moped
QUOTE . I tend to ignore ill tempered folk where I can as they do not fit in with my outlook on life
Absolutely 100% right.
But nothing is achieved by perpetually sticking one's head in the sand.
One might perhaps consider whether there might be legitimate reason for the occasional ill temper and whether it is just ever so faintly possible that one might have been directly responsible for provoking it. It might or might not be so, but it needs to be considered before blindly ignoring and continuing the provocation.

QUOTE Live never to be ashamed of what is said or written about you, even if what is said or written is not true.
Excellent advice but, like the rule of law, is effective ONLY for those who understand and respect it. Strange though it may seem to law abiding people, there is a sub-culture that actively prides itself in mischief making, law breaking, vandalism, cocking a snook at authority and being a damned nuisance to society in general.
 

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Well said Aaron, Lotus.

If we all want to know about ninco track.. The track is not as strong as other brands, the area where the tyres tread is not supported enough and sags so making the car lower and the rails raised. Poor design and my reason for not liking it. I would have gone for a wood track at wrexham now, but at the time it wasnt possible.

Inte.
 

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Again that`s an opinion and I disagree. We have had our club track down for three years without a problem. We regard the track as superb quality without a single electrical conection problem. Superb grip and the extra width is just about right. That is my opinion.
 

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QUOTE From a political standpoint it would probably be better for the moderators to stay silent as far as this topic goes.

Tee, hee. The words, "And you can whistle Dixie" come to mind.


And, where does the argument for or against Ninco track come into this thread?

My thoughts:

If a member makes a statement and is asked to clarify it, that really shouldn't be such a big problem... unless of course it's total fabrication.

There are two members on this board who repeatedly offer manufacturer news and information. They do so without recourse to hyperbole. They do so without making any sales pitch. I have not seen either be called out or taken to task over their words. They post their news in a matter-of-fact style.

Their IDs are Thomas and Russell Sheldon.

I feel that if I were to ask either a question they would answer it and not dodge the issue, put up a smoke screen or generally ignore it.

Both have my respect and I trust what I read from them yet I don't know the origins of their sources, I don't know what genuine connections they have with the manufacturers but I don't feel I need to question it at all.

I cannot say the same for the one called Moped.

As you were...
 

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I too wondered where the Ninco opinion came from,but there it was and I posted a reply. To be honest it was perhaps a perfect example of what was being discussed?The difference between an opinion and fact?

For me there are a great number of people here who I respect and to list them all would take a while but it stretches tO more than two! That`s just my opinion. As far as Moped is concerned, he often starts a sensible discussion which,aided by others, goes well off target. See Swiss`s point on the Lotus 7 thread `cos it`s bang on in my opinion.
 

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I think meco's post in the caterham summed up what was irritating in that case;

For me it was not so much the language or turn of phrase, but asking for something (a caterahm race) and then telling the clubs that were thinking of hosting such an event for moped, what rules they must use and what prizes they must supply!!!

It appears like childish and selfish behaviour, and disrespectful of the expertise and gratiousness of the club owners.

Sometimes I think moped has been picked on, but in the more recent threads, I tend to agree with the critics.
 

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I think most of my thoughts on this subject have been covered, but I can only tell you how I approach posting and replying on the Slotforum.

I base my posts and threads in the same way as I have to write for a printed article!

I liaise with a number of slot manufactures (on a weekly basis) and for one I write a monthly article Tecnitoys (SCX) for these articles (published in the NSCC journal) I have to get my facts right! I'm party to some very sensitive information, pictures, ideas and thoughts and I am often asked not to print or divulge any info on these subjects.

This I do, my relationship with these manufactures is a benefit to NSCC members and Forum visitors and I do not wish to upset them.

Thus any news, information I write, post or reply is (to the very best of my knowledge) fact and I can back it up. If I post anything that I am not sure of - I state so. If I am stating an opinion I will say so.

There have been many occasions that I have read posts knowing that the information stated as fact (or presented as such) is not true or at best very inaccurate. I chose not to reply or correct them most of the time, because I can't (due to my relationships with the manufacturers).

With regards to others presenting quotes, statements, articles etc as their own, when they are written by others - this is unacceptable. We have discussed Copyright before. Any quote, photo or written article copied from anther should (at the very least) mention the original author.

In general I think most people follow the above, but on occasion present their opinions or rumor as fact. This can be very damaging and could result in manufacturers deciding to tell us nothing in advance. If nothing else it can mislead new visitors to our site and new participants to our great hobby.

Gareth
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Tee, hee.

QUOTE As far as Moped is concerned, he often starts a sensible discussion which,aided by others, goes well off target.

Hmmm, I fancy they only go soooo far off target because questions, issues and claims go unanswered.

Then it looks like we are picking on the lad, then the cavalry ride in to draw attention to the whole thing and then I close the thread out


Where's me "close this thread" button....
 

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exactly why I dont post news.. 1 I get beaten to it or 2 I know someone will do it.

I said about ninco because someone asked then gave my opinion.. got a problem? good cos I dont wanna hear em.


Moped never answers questions so why bother asking? ah well think I'll go racing.
 

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great to have this thread lying around:

annoying stuff:
posting your opinion of rules that people should race by at races you are not going to take part in, and telling people in very strong terms how they should race

telling people what they can and can't say on the forum - are you a forum moderator? are you a spokesperson for the company u defend? No.
And when you do say a comment should have been made in private, then so should yours, or perhaps the company may have already made a private comment that you don't know about. Please use PM for comments like that.

Bigging up things that even you have major reservations about - first you say motGP is brilliant in everyway, then after a lot of banter you say it is great but only if you run it on the layouts illustrated on the box - quite a difference, and if this reservation had been in your original post to balance it, it would have given some credibility to ur comments. As it is, we can see u only give half the story, and why u feel the need to do so is beyond me. Scalextric will NOT crumble without your peculiar brand of 'help'
 

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QUOTE some credibility to ur comments.
Credibility is an acute problem.

QUOTE u only give half the story
Now Astro, please don't axaggerate! Half? We should be so lucky!

QUOTE Scalextric will NOT crumble without your peculiar brand of 'help'
Too right, the converse being considerably more likely.

Just think, if there were more than one of them!

They might breed!
 
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