[Swissracer]

At long last a Company with a long history in Slot Car racing has defined the answer to the old argument as to what involves more skill..

Magnet or Non Magnet driving.

So here it is, reproduced straight from the Carrera Evolution NEW users pamphlet..

QUOTE Tuning your vehicle: Carrera Evolution racing cars offer you a number of different possibilities for adjusting the magnets in order to change the road behaviour of the car, i,e. its road holding, drift, acceleration and braking behaviour.
Beginners: the vehicles as supplied have very good road holding and braking* behaviour and only have a little drift.
Advanced Drivers: medium road holding, drift and braking behaviour are acheived by changing the position of the rear magnet and removing the spacing plate.
Professionals: maximum drift is acheived by removing the rear magnet as well as the spacing plate

Taking it one step further logically, then those of us with NO magnets must simply be Slot Gods!

I think we can take the above as an end to the 'I am better than you because I have magnets and drive faster' argument?

After all.. who are we to argue with the experts?

PS: re 'Braking*' I really hope they actually meant Braking and not Breaking !

 

[Jimmy in Greece]

I wonder how we define those of us who like both? I like the magnets because they allow me to break things without getting arrested. I like the non-magnet because they make me angry enough to want to use the other ones. Must be a split personality

Jimmy

 

[speedyweenie]

Verily, you mere mortals, cast your vile magnets aside and you too may be able to join the truly divine in slot nirvana!!

Not to step on Moped's toes, but I wonder what "we" would be saying if Scaley came up with a similar statement about driving skill? Instant gospel I'm sure.

mp

 

[Scatman]

From someone who just made the switch to non-magnet, I would have to say it's a lot of fun. Just setting up the car (gears, weight, tires) to run well on your track is a blast. Before it was just change the tires and add a tweaker magnet for more speed. Well, after driving without a magnet I'm thinking more when I'm driving the car. Just last night I changed gears on a car and the car runs better now than it did when it had the magnet. I could not have done it without the help from this Forum. For those of you who are thinking of switching, check the topic I started under Master Classes, Topic

Tony

 

[skippy #1 slot]

Just been racing Fly classics with the magnets removed, I am a non-mag racer myself

Most of my collection have the magnets removed, it's just more fun and real this way

what do you do with all your spare magnets - I put mine on the end of the screwdriver and use it to hold the screws when messing with the cars insides

skippy

 

[jonny s]

Skippy is a sly dog!! You are one of the top racers at Phoenix. Stop being so modest mate. Another good race night tonight and good to see Pete C back racing. Mac P is on board and reckons he will get down to Phoenix soon. Check out latest on annual meeting page 5. SCX World Rally Championship at Phoenix...oh yes!

 

[moped rider]

To me, it seems a bit weird that Carrera, having spent a fortune adapting their chassis to take a bar magnet, immediately come out with something that suggests that you remove it if you want to class yourself as a better driver.

Come on Tropi, where is the logic in that then?

There are good drivers and bad drivers in all classes of racing. Skill is not to be factored by how much or little downforce you have.

Moped

 

[Tropi]

Carrera are now covering more bases with their cars and that's a good thing.
They definitely appeal to a wider variety of driver preferences and skills than they did.

Where is the logic?
It's the same logic that says it takes more skill to walk a tightrope than walk a plank.
The same logic that says, no matter how skilled you may become at riding a bike with its outriggers, when you want to further develop your skills, you take them off.
But no one is making it compulsory to do that.
Although I probably would if I could, just because I am a latent sadist!

 

[Jimmy in Greece]

If I really think about it Carrera cars were never very good magnet cars out of the box. In fact, I don't run any magnets in their classics and I downgrade the motor to NC1 type. The Lemans cars need a bit of Magnet tuning if they are to be run with the other Mfgrs cars(except Ninco) of the same type. In non magnet mode the old chassis Bently isn't even a very good non magnet car out of the box. So if you're running Carrera cars and you're one of the "good" drivers that doen't use magnets you may find yourself near the back of the grid in box stock

Jim

 

[Tropi]

Hi Jim and so pleased to see you here with us.

I don't disagree with your assessment of the old Carreras.
But most of our club races have quite draconian definitions of box stock, so much so that a Carrera race excludes anything but Carreras! I'm still not sure whether I entirely like this, but I have to admit that it does, in the main, produce fairly argument proof racing for fairly equal cars.

Also, Carrera cars are in a smallish minority at my club - probably the same at most clubs - for now.
I believe the REAL reasons for this have little to do with our guys making informed choices, but have much more to do with lack of knowledge and availability in the first place, followed by a conservative fear of the unknown and fear of being 'different'. Most of our guys have been around for quite a long time, living and racing in a very small community without a great deal of exposure to the internet and have become brain-washed with, first Scalextric (naturally), and then Fly and Ninco. Limited budgets and limited publicity and VERY limited stockists for makes other than these, all tend to pruduce a narrow range of only the most well-known products in the members' stables.

Strangely enough, although I am the oldest member by age, I am the newest by joining date, and my more adventurous and experimental inclinations have alerted them to a greater variety, naturally including Carrera. So they are beginning to appear more frequently at our meetings, if not necessarily raced formally. I eventually managed to have the very first Carrera only race organised, but, ironically, was not able to attend myself when it took place!

In a sense, the new Carreras could further fragment the club racing classes, but my intention is to work towards grouping more and more similar makes and models together. This will take some doing, as it's very hard to get much agreement from a group of varied individuals! But this won't stop me from trying.

 

[jonny s]

Good and well thought out post Tropi. I could add that the Phoenix club experience is that if it races well then we don`t care who makes what car. The truth is that you have to assess a car based on how the manufacturer has manufactured it and right now they come with magnets and it`s through our shared experiences of trying to improving any car that we can benefit from this forum. I`ll have to get back to you on the Carerra Ferrari F1 cos so far I can`t find a way to make it go!

 

[Intergrali]

well in that case we had about 16 Expert racers at Wrexham today.. does it say anything about racing at full speed for an hour or so?

Also, that means I have been an Expert for a LOOOONG time!

Inte

 

[jonny s]

Have you been drinking your own bath water again? I haven`t got a clue what your last post was about mate!?

 

[Intergrali]

Once upon a time in a land far far away

Beer is the only drink

Beer can fuel the mind and stop adrenaline running

Beer tastes nice too

Beer is served in pubs clubs and bars but not behind them.

Beer is not free but makes you feel good

other things are free and can do the same thing

Beer is for the knowledgeable ones.. Wines for the old fartz

zzzzzzzZAP!

whoa! er yea, we raced a 4 hour enduro without mags, so were all one better than carrera suggests so experts but I have run no mag cars for a looooong time so I have been an expert for a loooong time!

Inte

 

[jonny s]

Clear to me now mate!

 

[Intergrali]

Smirnoff?

Inte

 

[Mooster]

I prefer the magnet cars, but it seems I can also do the wobbly ones as well.
The last thing I need at this point is to again be told that I'm a slow developer.

Bah.

Mooster

 

[Tropi]

QUOTE The last thing I need at this point is to again be told that I'm a slow developer.
You think big mags might be the equivalent of long bonnets, Moo?

 

[Mooster]

Well, they are very attractive!....

Mooster

 

[Jimmy in Greece]

Tropi,
I'm a little perplexed. How do you guys that run box stock manage to find time to run all the classes if you seperate mfgrs cars? Isn't it better to allow some tuning either weight or magnets, one motor type, one tire type or some combination so that many brands of the same type can run together. Even voltage handicaps for top 3 places can even things out if you manage it correctly and have seperate variable power for each lane (This can get overly complex). There are groups in northern Europe that are able to run low downforce magnet and non-magnet cars together competitively using a simple downforce measuring devise (scale setup).

Getting back to this whole magnet -no magnet discussion I don't think that the skills required are any greater for either if your're talking low to medium magnet downforce. In high downforce it gets very difficult to consistantly drive a car on the edge and running endurance races with this type of setup would be very challanging indeed. One missed decelleration point on the track and your car can require major maintainance. Non magnet cars are for the most part more forgiving and in a long race can probably be driven more consistantly with less concentration. Missed braking points don't usually spell disaster.

I was tuning a high magnet setup the other day and lost it on one of my 90degree turns that can usually be taken at full speed and a quick throttle blip with this type of setup. The car hit the wall and litterally self-destructed. Body broke, chassis broke, motor setup seperated, the rear axle bent as well as one rim and the crown gear was destroyed, probably by the motor seperation. I haven't had a non-magnet car incident like that since I had a controller fail full on. It just doesn't seem to happen. So while the skill required to drive each type of car may be different I don't think one can assume that one type of racing is better than the other. Maybe less expensive but not better.

Jim