[lenny broke]

Evening all
With the release of the Porsche 911 by Fly recently some debate has arisen about the position of the motor in the chassis.

All this tripe about placing the motor as in the 1:1 example, apart from the fact that the position in the 911 does not make for a good handling non mag car it's orientation is in fact incorrect. The motor on the full size car in fact islongitudinal not as transverse as in the fly representation.

So if Senor Barrios wants to place the motor in his models as in the real car the motor should be mounted in an inline position. This also applies to all his Classic range and tha GB track cars with rear engines, with the exception of the Lancia Betta Grp 5 car which unless I am very much mistaken (and yes I could well be) was transverse in 1:1.
The future Lancia 037 will have the correct position.

So to me all this talk of correct positioning of motors in the correct place is somewhat redundant.

This philosophy spoils some cars that should for me be great handling slot cars.

My half a dinaris' worth anyway

I think I'll put on my flak jacket now and dodge the incoming
LB

 

[astro]

the biggest factor an engine's placement has on a 1:1 car (and a slot car) is its weight distribution relative to the wheel base. Yes the moment force due to the turning of the shaft, the weight and complexity of the gearing etc have a big affect too, but not the most significant.

If you don't like the way cars handle with a rear engine, avoid 1:1 and 1:32 911s!

 

[McLaren]

Who would buy a 1:1 Porsche anyway?!?!

I'd just prefer it if every slot car came with an mount hole like the slot.it one, so we can decide to run it inline or sidewinder, but all of them MID-MOUNTED!

Front and rear engined cars are crap in slot car format, so I don't understand why any manufacturer would make them.

What would you prefer?

A car you have always loved is produced by a slot car manufacturer:

Case A: It has the correct placement of the motor, and therefore can only be run with a magnet, and even then it's not really competitive.

Case B: The motor is mid-mounted and therefore can compete with all of you other favourite cars, and for all you know looking at it from the outside, it could be in the right place.

A or B

Andy

 

[astro]

competitive????

all cars are competitive in their own class. Why would you want to race a slot 911 with a slot F1 or lola MG????

and if the back end of the 911 is NOT sliding out wildly, then you just KNOW that the engine is in the wrong place!

 

[jonny s]

Orientation? A or B? AC ? DDC?

I`ve heard you swing both ways anyway Andy!!

 

[McLaren]

Cheers Jonny...

But if you ran non-mag Fly 911 against Ninco 934, the 934 will win easy.

That's pretty rubbish IMO.

Andy

 

[astro]

didn't ninco put the motor in the wrong place?

 

[McLaren]

Yes, but my point is that it's a nice car to drive without magnets.

To be honest with you, I was never really into sports car racing, so I don't know what else competed with the 911 on the track.

What did? Has it been made in 1/32? Where was the motor?

Andy

 

[Difflock]

Sometimes, even mid-mounted placement of the motor in a 1:32 car doesn't improve it's handling over the 1:1 prototype - Scalextric 3.0 litre Capri anyone?

[Dons armoured vest of Disregard - ready for attacks on his beloved Ford]

 

[LMP]

Comparisions shouldnt be made between 1:1 placement and 1:32 placement. FWD and front sidewinders all pop up and i dont want to go into that.

Fly's placing of the 911 motor is novel, and based on the 1:1. It doesnt have to be an exact replica to be recognisable.

Toy cars guys...................

 

[gboulton]

As the former owner of two 1:1 911's....

It's a downright fun car to drive. Is it the greatest I've had the pleasure of driving? Eh...at some things maybe, at others, no.

It's like any other car...it has certain characteritics that the driver must account for when operating the vehicle in a setting that pushes the automobile and its driver to their limits.

*shrug*

Seems to me that 1:32 cars are the same way. They can be fun to operate without necessarily be the best in their class at certain (or any) things. And, like their 1:1 counterparts, they have certain characteristics that must be accounted for by the operator. IMO, it doesn't matter a whole heck of a lot if those "tricks" are the same in the 1:32 car as they are in the 1:1 car since...well...THEY'RE DIFFERENT 'CARS'.

Agreed, LMP...Toy cars, guys...Toy cars.

And McLaren. Case A, hands down. If I want it to compete with certain other cars, I'll do what I'd do to a 1:1 car...modify it as necessary and as possible. Or do enough research to know it WON'T compete with certain other cars and, if it's that important to me that I do so, buy something else.

/gb

 

[Difflock]

QUOTE (LMP04 @ 5 Jan 2005, 13:54)Toy cars guys...................
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Hence my lighthearted post. Sorry I didn't make it clearer

Mark.

 

[McLaren]

*rolls eyes*

 

[lenny broke]

Evenin all again
I guess I posted last night in a fit of pique, dissappointed by the way Fly had done the motor mount on the 911.

Yes I know they are toy cars, I often remind others of this when it gets nasty now and again. I was just being a pedant over how the motors are oriented in the chassis

I was really looking forward to this release but at the price that fly cars are and the way it is likely to handle with that chassis layout.
I don't think I will bother getting one , unless one of the rich kids at my track gets dissillusioned enough with it to put one on the second hand shelf cheap at my local track. ( Got a nice Ninco Cobra I had my eye on the previous week that way)

Then I'll probably whack a Slot it HRS Chassis under it and use it for a fun car.

Actually I've just given my self an idea for a possible category at my track.

HRS RTR kit with any 1/32 body.

Have to ask the owner what he thinks

Cheers LB

 

[John Cahill]

along the lines of astro's early comment on this thread...I agree, clearly you would think that the reason for moving the motor to various positions is for weight distribution, and not mere novelty. The motor weight, even the drivetrain weight, is only a significant piece of the overall weight which is largely dictated by the bodies and ancillary equipement in production cars (not so much pure race cars of course).

I would hope that the manufacturerers would position the motor (and add magnets or whatever) such that the car actually handles similarly to the 1:1 car. It should replicate it's front/rear weight distribution, it's yawing inertia and even roll-over inertia. I mean...IF they want to do that

so...does the 911 in 1/32 handle like a 1:1? just curious....

John

 

[a Bill]

I would hope that the manufacturerers would position the motor (and add magnets or whatever) such that the car actually handles similarly to the 1:1 car.

That's impossible. No matter how close to scale you make it, it's still a toy car. No shocks, no suspension, mass in different locations, no transmissions, torque and horse power curves totally wrong, weight transfer incorrect, air molecules too large, ...oh poo, I forgot the rest of what I was going to say

I had this big long completely frivolous speach worked out and I forgot it. I have to learn to write this stuff down in advance and save it for later. Ahh, you probably wouldn't have fallen for it anyway

You can only take 'scale' so far since you can't scale everything. They sure do look good though.

Could you imagine how delicate these cars would be if they were truly scale? The fenders would probably have to be stamped out of a thin aluminum foil because I don't think you can get steel that thin easily. I don't even want to think about running capillary tubing for the brake lines

 

[astro]

QUOTE (a Bill @ 6 Jan 2005, 21:04)Could you imagine how delicate these cars would be if they were truly scale? The fenders would probably have to be stamped out of a thin aluminum foil because I don't think you can get steel that thin easily. I don't even want to think about running capillary tubing for the brake lines

hmmm - maybe titanium would be better. Want one!

 

[McLaren]

1/32 scale air molecules...

You're on to something there Bill!

No more need for silly magnets, just real working aerofoils!

Andy

 

[LMP]

^

Im working on that. And they do work, on some cars.

 

[Isetta]

LMP04 "Im working on that. And they work".

Yes, but not realistically... you can't overcome scale effect - unless you operate your Slot Track in a Compression Chamber to lower the Reynolds Number to a more realistic level...... now that would add a whole new meaning to racing under pressure

But this is a fun thread.

Cheers, Tom.