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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
I thaught that the ninco power boost was meant to counter the effects of de-sloting wille using just one psu. I´ve seen mentioned on this boards that it also "regulates" the power.

The question is: I have 20 mts of a one lane rally track, with 4 or 5 (dont remember exactly how many) power taps, running with a standard ninco PSU. i dont notice any major problems, but acording to my experience, that power doesnt seem so "stable" as the DS units that are used at my club. i dont have any metering devices to check how much power do i get.

does anyone think that this "power-boost" device would help me on getting a "cleaner" power or i should save some more money for the DS PSU´s and buy one of those instead? I´m running on a tight budget (aren´t we all?) so the expenditure on the ninco device would be better welcomed than the DS (or other PSU´s for that matter).

what do you guys reckon?
 

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Hello fragoso.

The Ninco Power Boost is nothing else, like a electrolytic capacitor with a dc-connector to the Ninco sport-connector track (its a 2,1mm DC-connector).

You can use every electrolytic capacitor with 40V or more (because the Ninco psu have 32V peak voltage).
And for everey 1 ampere current you need 1000uF (for the ninco 700mA psu is that enough).

Ok, you need a 1000uF / 40V electrolytic capacitor for the ninco psu.

And this component is much more cheaper than the ninco power boost.

---> You have to check out the polarity before you connect it on the track. Mostly the minus alignment is marked with a line for minus!

Tschau, Roland.
 

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it will smooth your power removing any AC ripple, no it's not good for you or your motors, neither is rasberry ripple ice cream


the DS PSU will be one of the best additions you will make to your circuit
 

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Discussion Starter · #4 ·
so i´ll just need to add a 1000uf/40V electrolitic capacitor at the power input and i´ll get "cleaner" power? its a pretty simple and cheap job. i´ll try to do that tonight and i´ll post the results.

i dont need nothing fancy, but anything cheap that contributes to my track quality its welcomed.
 

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Discussion Starter · #5 ·
btw: do you guys think that in a small track like mine (ninco 20mts) the DS PSU (or a similar one) would make such a big diference?
 

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Julius Wilkko
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Excellent answer by Roland H.

And here is a picture of the 1000uF capacitor. Propably something like this can be found inside NINCO power boost.



"Axial" = leads stick out at opposite ends of capacitor
"Radial" = leads at same end
Note that the minus pole (-) is marked on the component.

In my opinion you can get away with 25V rating as well. Cost of one 1000uF/25V cap is usually less that 1 euro.


Julius
 

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Julius Wilkko
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PS.

Fragoso, might not make big difference, but capacitors are so cheap that you can experiment and see for yourself.

Julius
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
the results were interesting: with my fly controler, it didnt made any diference. with the standard ninco ones it produced a more linear response. not as many "hicups" as it used to, the controlers are more reliable now. very nicely spent 65 cents, even if i´m not geting much out of it (as i said the fly controler stays as it was), i´ll be advising everyone that i know of to do it.
 

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Fragoso,
I run a similar Ninco track, how/where did you wire the capacitor in?
Wanted to wire up longer controller wires as well, so could they be wired into them?

Cheers
Chris
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
i just soldered the capacitor beetween the ninco psu wires and its plug, being carefull to align the - and + signs with the right wires. preety simple and it makes me wonder why the hell doesnt this PSU´s come with this capacitor right from the start...


i dont think you´ll need to wire the capacitor to the controlers or the track. you´ll just wire it to the PSU. i´ll try to get a meter and see the results metrically, with and without the capacitor.
 

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Discussion Starter · #12 ·
how come the PSU has a influence on braking power? i thaught that it was mostly a thing related to the motor and the gear/pinion ratio. whats the phenomena involved, how does it work?
 

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Well Fragoso,

I'm not good at electronics and no expert either, but as far as I Know. it's got sth to do with amps.
And I insit, it's my feeling comparing this power supply to others, racing in the same conditions with the same controller (turbo qualifier 45 OH) same car, same ratio, same motor and tyres.

 

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Brian Ferguson
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Ummmm..... actually, the PSU has absolutely no effect on braking. It can't. There is no power from the PSU involved! On tracks wired for dynamic braking, and assuming the controllers are too, then the braking effect comes from the fact that the track rails are shorted together when the controller is in the brake position thus placing a heavy load across a decelerating motor (which acts as a generator during braking). No power from the power supply is involved. If dynamic braking is not in use, then the car is merely coasting. Again, no power from the PSU is involved.
 

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QUOTE (Fragoso @ 13 Jul 2004, 16:02)how come the PSU has a influence on braking power?
Let me tell you how.

Imagine the PSU with capacitor. If peak voltage is 12 volts, installing such cap voltages grows up to 16 volts without load. When you apply load (a motor, a car), a "ripple" is created and voltage drops to approx. 15 volts. Why? Because cap can't give a constant, perfect DC voltage so as long as the voltage is not maximum, capacitor does "as much as he can".

Now let's slow down with our controller: voltage across motor decreases as long as we release the trigger BUT since load is being decreased, voltage across cap rises again up to 16v. This means that, as lons as you speed up your controller, power supply is decreasing voltage; and the more you release your trigger, the more voltage the power source feeds the motor. This paradox is how electronis behaves under load.

Power supplies from DS as well as electroncs PSU (such as ham radio o laboratory) are stabilized, that means, that electronics constantly tracks output, and corrects when there's a shift. That means, if you select 12 volts, there will be 12 volts without load as well as maximum load.

The easiest, fastest way to check this is installing a "7812" chip between non-stabilized PSU+cap -and- load. The 3-pin "7812" chip stabilizes output to 12 volts, 1 Amper. Facing writing in fron of us, lef pin is input (PSU), right pin is output (controller, track) and center+heatsink pin sin ground, common. It costs less than 1€ so you can cheaply experiment with it. Or you can buy a stabilized PSU.
 

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Brian Ferguson
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QUOTE This means that, as lons as you speed up your controller, power supply is decreasing voltage; and the more you release your trigger, the more voltage the power source feeds the motor. This paradox is how electronis behaves under load.

Well, yes, that would occur under deceleration, but not once the trigger reaches the full brake position. Also, you would only see this apparent "spike" of voltage for a tiny fraction of a second when first beginning to decelerate - a 1000uF cap will charge almost instantly.

As Nep points out, though, a properly regulated supply exhibits no such evil behaviour. I think all serious hobbyists owe it to themselves to buy a good PSU.
 

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Discussion Starter · #17 ·
i really have to figure out if its worth the imediate investiment. its something that i´ll be doing in the future, but i believe the Ninco PSU is serving me right for now. I´m doing a permanent track now, and i´ll be soldering all track pieces to each other just to make really sure even 20 years from now there´ll be current flowing on the thing. After doing that i´ll take a wille to enjoy the track and then i´ll assess the investiment on a DS, Kelvin Light or other PSU.
 

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Hi! I would like to try the DIY power boost on my Ninco track....but I'm still not sure where to install the capacitor??? Do put in parallel with the PSU (that is minus to minus and plus to plus)

I've tried connecting plus from the cap to plus on the power straight and minus to minus on the p.straight. But nothing happens...what am I doing wrong?

Please be very specific


Morten
 

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OK, It's very easy: as you stated, connect positive from capacitor to positive of PSU (white-lined wire), and negative of capacitor (there's a line) with negative of PSU.

Here's an old 3-voltage selector:

Left side goes to PSU, up is positive, down is negative.
Rigt side goes to track
"Condensador" means capacitor
"Interruptor" means switch, 3 positions (ON-OFF-ON), 1 circuit.
Just be careful when connecting the capacitors. Enjoy!
 
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