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novice jazz player &
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My thinking is...

For Scalextric and Carrera cars the lighting PCBs are usually attached to the chassis so a shorter FFC makes best sense (e.g. 50mm)

For brands where the lights are attached directly to the body shell - I think longer makes sense... as per Davelat's above comment... i.e. long enough that the body can be separated from the chassis without straining the FFC cable. (e.g 80mm).

I think having two options makes perfect sense.

c
 

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Premium Member
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Discussion Starter · #42 ·
My thinking is...

For Scalextric and Carrera cars the lighting PCBs are usually attached to the chassis so a shorter FFC makes best sense (e.g. 50mm)

For brands where the lights are attached directly to the body shell - I think longer makes sense... as per Davelat's above comment... I.e. long enough that the body can be separated from the chassis without straining the FFC cable. (e.g 80mm).

I think having two options makes perfect sense.

c
Agreed
thumbsup.gif
for my lighting arrangment 80mm would be perfect
 

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BTW a 80mm cable is going to be on sale soon.

We actually purchased several 50mm cables but believed they'd be too short. Any opinions on this, before we take any decisions about which one to sell?
Hello Maurizio
Just bought four SP44 sets.. two days ago...hoping that the Flat cable would be longer than the 50mm of the Hall sensor cable..but its not?!
lmfao.gif

Well at least I won't have to do 4x 3 wire SMD soldering to convert hall sensor into light Flat cables.

Then even better good news is that you're going to stock 80 mm as yes with the SP44 in the body when not glued under the interior tray....50mm is a bit short.
80mm would be much better. And I prefer to buy from you then directly from China.
Any idea how soon.."available soon" is? Are we talking weeks..or months?

Also, any idea why so few retailers have the SP44 in stock? I had to order mine in France...
ohmy.png

Most retailers seem to be totally unaware that the kit exists...let alone that it can be ordered
innocent.gif


With kind regards
Tamar
 

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ParrotGod
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I am not sure but looking at the pics of Dave's install in the porsche 50mm looks right to me.

It requires to fold the strip on itself only once. With 80mm you might need to bent the strip twice.

Also if the the strip is too stiff it might lift the body.
 

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Like I said, 50mm good for install right above the O2 C-chip Light kit glued to the interior, but anywhere else?
Just do the math, most chassis are 50-55 mm wide so point to point you'll need 20-25 mm, but you cannot do point to point.
You need to curve the flat cable and need extra length to be able to lift the body and place it next to the chassis.
You'd also want a bit of extra length so you'll be able to insert the cable into the connector (and that will require some practice to do it fast on an emergency pit stop)
I would prefer a 70mm FFC but see no problem in a fold and a twist with 80mm. Probably a reverse FFC.

Would not worry about the flat cable lifting the body, unless they are much heavier and stiffer than the Hall Sensor FFC's.
Weight gain is one of the reasons that tipped the scale (pun intended) in favor of a switch from B2 to C- chip and FFC cables.
The "old" B2 type light connectors were never my favorite, just had to deal with them...but Plug and wires 0,5 -0,7 gr....FFC est. 0,05gr (Scale didn't even wanted to register one FFC cable)

Which reminds me of a question: Gio in your post on the Scalex Vantage there's an image of you scale (looks identical to mine) showing double digits behind the comma.
How did you get your scale to do that? Mine only wants to show 10ths of grams.

With kind regards
Tamar
 

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ParrotGod
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Where are you planning to mount the lightkit? If 50mm is good enough to install the lightkit in the centre of the body (right above the chip when the body sits on top of the chassis) then you should get extra length if the kit is going to be fixed on the side of the body (do the math :p).

By the way, using this strip to connect the chip with the light kit the sockets/ports on both need to be perfectly aligned. At least with the B2, the connector has more flexible wires that you can flex in all directions.

I also dislike the JSP connectors on the B2 (usually they interfere with interiors) but I dislike even more the strips in the C chip for the hall sensor and now for the lightkit.

To be honest, I would rather have some pads on both chips so that I could solders the wires for the hall sensors and lights directly on the chip.

As for the scale, I know what you mean...I do not recall where I bought mine but after reading a post from you about using multiple scales for checking the weight distribution I bought three more.

They look exactly the same as the one i have but they only have one decimal (not double as my first one).

Check here (https://www.ebay.com/itm/193959161215?hash=item2d28dded7f:g:XMMAAOSw-Ihdrf1B) and you can see that there are several options. Go for the 500 x 0.01g.
 

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I did the math Gio...and tested it physically.
innocent.gif


SP44 will go where I always place my light kits, inside the doors with the Goldcap as low as possible.
I don't like mounting Light kits under the interior. With all the led cabling attached it becomes near impossible to dismount the interior tray.
Inside the doors..less of a problem.
So these images were due at a later stage to be posted in my Vantage GT3/GTE topic..but ok here they are "on topic" as well.

As you can see, you need more length going to the side than straight up and over.
Ok so this is a physical mock-up with a spare (50mm short) Hall sensor FFC, but as my SP44 kits are in transit to les Pays Bas..I photoshopped one in position.
Size should be more or less ok, taking the width of the FFC connector as a reference.
Blue Vehicle Automotive design Motor vehicle Hood


On the left you'll see the curve the FFC needs to make with the C-Chip mounted transversely. With 50mm you can't place the body next to the chassis without disconnecting the FFC cable.
To make the picture on the left it took a 5 min balancing act to get it to stay in place with the body resting on the chassis.
Go figure how that would work during a untimely pitstop where you need to work on your car...in the dark.
Center image is the position required to mount the FFC into the C-Chip connector... You have to rotate the body 90˚, manage to get hold of the FFC and guide it into the connector slot..and flip the lid shut.
Takes a bit of practice, most likely a lot of practice before doing this under 30 sec..in the dark.
Once connected and with the body mounted...all is ok, it fits...but just.... although even now you see the tension in the FFC twisting its placement on the sticky foam pad.

For a side mounted SP44, 50mm is a bit short, 80mm not ideal but should provide better acces and mounting.

With kind regards
Tamar
 

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ParrotGod
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Ok, it makes more sense now because I can see where the new light kit has the connector. Also I can see that you are mounting the chip transversally which is not the way I would install it.

So yes in your case the 80mm is the one that you need.

My reasoning was based on the light kit install posted here by Dave.

Anyway, even with 80mm these connectors and the strip are going to be challenging to deal with in the dark.
 

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Ok, it makes more sense now because I can see where the new light kit has the connector. Also I can see that you are mounting the chip transversally which is not the way I would install it.
That's the second reason why I've switched to the C-chip. as you may know I prefer triangulated pod suspension with the O2 Chip mounted "flexible" on the chassis..not the pod.
With the C-chip in its transversal direction it is much easier to mount with a much bigger contact surface than the "ears" of the old B2 chip.
Lead wires to the guide less than ideal this way, but motor wire need to to to one side of the car anyway, so transversal placement actually shortens (= less weight) their lenght.
(at least once I've trimmed them to proper length)

As for the tasking task of mounting the FFC in the dark..yes absolutely agree, so longer cable required so we don't have to (dis)connect the FFC in the dark.
thumbsup.gif


With kind regards
Tamar
 

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novice jazz player &
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Great that our leading lights with insights into keeping the lights on in the darkness of 24 racing... are illuminating the thread with expert views :) sincere thanks.

On the simplified OP question of options... we appear now to have three options for connection of lights to C1 decoders...

1/ The professionally manufactured and retailed SP44 kit from Slot.it (with extra features as discussed here and elsewhere)
2/ A low cost and far more basic DIY version - just a FFC socket on a very small PCB.
3/ Precision hand soldering of wires directly onto an FFC cable.

I might try one more option... direct smd connection of the FFC cable onto the PCBs used in above approach 2. Possibly lower cost and easier to assemble?

c
 

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Gary Skipp
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6,533 Posts
From my POV on the darkness pit stop scenario, any pit work that requires the body off may as well have the body, OFF. No point having it dangle by a cable. Disconnect that cable and get it our of there! Until it's ready to be put back on
biggrin.png


Has it really been so long that we've forgotten the realities of these things? Let's not slip into the fantasies of unrealistic optimisation guys
wink.png
 

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ParrotGod
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I understand that soldering is not for everyone, but if you are into slot cars then some basic soldering skills should be acquired.

Maybe consider an approach where the sockets/ports are not on the chip but on leads soldered on pads on the edges of the chip: this is similar to carrera approach to lights and power.

For the less advanced users, they can use whatever connectors you put on those leads. For the more advanced ones, they can de-solder the leads and put in whatever connectors or wires they like.
 

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ParrotGod
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Has it really been so long that we've forgotten the realities of these things? Let's not slip into the fantasies of unrealistic optimisation guys
wink.png
From my point of view I was not even considering to work on the car while the body is attached.
But when I need to take the body off or put back in, you need to have some distance between chassis and body to be able to connect back the light wires.

For me, to make sure that such operations happen smoothly, i need the body of the car to sit on its side next to the chassis while the chassis is flat on the workbench.
 

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So the postman rang twice today, my order of the SP44 kits has arrived..and guess what.
I got 4 SP44 kits with a 80mm "reverse" FFC, not the advertised 50mm "forward" FCC
lmfao.gif

...and guess what...I'm happy with it!
Communication Device Telephony Gadget Rectangle Automotive lighting

So, dimensions are very similar to the old SP17 light kit, including the old connector and some 3mm LED's, won't be using any of that.
SP44 including 80mm FFC tips the scales at 1,9gr of which 1,2 gr goes to the gold cap alone.
FFC as flexible as the name implies, feels a bit softer and more flexible than the Hall sensor FFC.
SP44 FFC has a bit longer "handle" at both ends, with makes inserting the FFC in the connector a lot easier...but with SP44 mounted in body..still not very easy.
I would recommend inserting FFC onto SP44 board before mounting it in the body. More room for 1/1 fingers to fiddle with Cable and connector on the chassis.

Automotive parking light Vehicle Hood Automotive lighting Motor vehicle

As you can see in the images above, 80mm FFC does allow you to take off the body without needing to disconnect the cable.

Takes a bit of fiddling with the cable to lead the FFC in the right direction, but once routed properly 0,05gr FFC certainly not strong enough to lift the body or interfere with body float.

But..not 100% happy with the position of the Gold cap, might desolder that from the board and mount it on the opposite side of the body...but that's more something for an other topic

With kind regards
Tamar
 

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ParrotGod
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ok because I thought that it was super quick delivery....so the FFC you got are the ones in the in kit?
 

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Yes Gio

The 80mm "reverse" FFC was included in the SP44 kit.

As opposed to the 50mm "forward" FFC as mentioned by Maurizio...weird eh?

Also small correction to my earlier posts, wherever I referred to the "old" Slot.it Light kit as SP17...that's wrong, the correct part nr for the old light kit is SP16c.
My bad..sorry

With kind regards

Tamar
 

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I also second the flaming options although I think you would need some special pads for them and I am not sure if Slot.it has designed their light kit to support them.
An oXigen car knows when it's in pit-lane mode, so it will be easy to change lighting frequency.
Flaming may be implemented, one day...
All of this requires some additional firmware on the C/B2 chip, but the possibility exists.
You all know that patience isn't one of my strongest virtues. Flaming exhaust pipe led's operated via the O2 Incar chip has been so long on my wishlist....I wanted it "today"
innocent.gif

So last night I hooked up the SP44 to the C-Chip, works great, mounting the wires first though the board and then back to the soldering pads is a big improvement compared to the old SP16c, similar to what I'm used to on the Z-machine light kits.

SP44 with Z-Machine flaming exhaust led's
So I had some Z-machine light kits which I ordered for the 2020 LM24hrs laying around.
This kit (the ZM134TX) has a separate board for my beloved flaming exhaust led's with the smd resistors and (555) timer that generates the pulses.
The Flaming exhaust board is normally powered by the gold cap on the"master" board when normal power is interrupted. (most Z-machine light kit are designed for analoge racing)
Now I noticed in the manual that the SP44 has extra soldering pads to connect it to the 'Old" 3 wire cable & connector (like on the B2 Chips), so I wondered what if?
Guess what else you can do with those extra pads?
Circuit component Passive circuit component Hardware programmer Electrical wiring Audio equipment


So I connected the wire that would normally go from the Flaming exhaust board to the + of the Z-machine gold cap to the extra Brake soldering pad on the SP44 and the - wire of the Z-machine flaming exhaust board to the extra -pad on the SP44.
And guess what, it works … I now have Z-machine Flaming exhaust with the Flaming exhaust leds connected to and operated by the SP44 every time I hit the brakes
smile.png


Here's a video link:

With kind regards
Tamar
 
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