[Slotrace.dk]

I tried SSD once and the race ended with an "Overload"!
What does it mean and why does it happen?
We were six guys racing - if you need that info!

 

[randybrown]

QUOTE (Slotrace.dk @ 15 Dec 2004, 09:21)I tried SSD once and the race ended with an "Overload"!
What does it mean and why does it happen?
We were six guys racing - if you need that info!
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

How many power supplies did you have hooked into the track?

Overload could be caused by a number of things: crossed braids one of them.

{rb}

 

[SinclairZX81]

Was someone placing their car back on the track when this happened?

 

[astro]

could even be a fallen off loose strand of braid shorting the rails. Try cleaning the slot with a brush.

 

[SinclairZX81]

The salient point here is that the entire race is voided. So 99 laps into a 100 lap event a marshall placing a de-slotted car back on the track momentarily short-circuits it and inadvertently voids the whole race. Is it just me or does this seem... uhh... a bit broken to anyone else?

 

[darainbow]

QUOTE (SinclairZX81 @ 15 Dec 2004, 23:38)The salient point here is that the entire race is voided. So 99 laps into a 100 lap event a marshall placing a de-slotted car back on the track momentarily short-circuits it and inadvertently voids the whole race. Is it just me or does this seem... uhh... a bit broken to anyone else?
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yes! This is one of the poor design decisions that I believe hornby made. Integrating the scoring/timing with the power delivery. If these were kept separate, then even if you need to reset power delivery, you have not lost race results.

This also may be a result of the AC grid they use. I havent had any shorts on my carrera track and there are no warnings about it happening in the directions.

 

[darainbow]

BTW, I just intentionally shorted my carrera digital (by putting a key ring across the rails) to see what happens. The base unit throws an error code which stops the cars and requires turning off the power and turning it back on.

Fuses sometimes blow in analog racing, so I guess this is similar.

Additionally, do you need to recode the cars after the reset?

 

[Skeeter]

if your using something with electric, you have to expect errors and shortages and stuff. its all a part of racing

 

[SWoRd]

QUOTE (darainbow @ 15 Dec 2004, 23:54)Yes! This is one of the poor design decisions that I believe hornby made.Yes, that's certainly a bad decision

QUOTE Integrating the scoring/timing with the power delivery.I think that integration of scoring, timing and power delivery is an ok design decision ... it saves hardware and keeps the price down.

Resetting the score when there is a short circuit, on the other hand, is an increadibly stupid decision

Why not just continue the race when the short has been resolved

QUOTE If these were kept separate, then even if you need to reset power delivery, you have not lost race results.You can turn off power to the slots without turning off power to the base station. That's what an overload protection should do.

QUOTE This also may be a result of the AC grid they use. I havent had any shorts on my carrera track and there are no warnings about it happening in the directions.There's no technical reason that an AC control scheme should be of any disadvantage in handling short circuits. Regardless of the communication method used - if you short the slot, you're not going to get any communication through the slot, wether it's DC or AC.

They ought to be able to change this in the base station software ... but who knows

Søren

 

[Skeeter]

doesnt the LC short the slot anyway, thats y u cant run analogue power on a track with a LC?

 

[astro]

QUOTE (Skeeter @ 16 Dec 2004, 01:02)doesnt the LC short the slot anyway, thats y u cant run analogue power on a track with a LC?
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

no

1) it looks like in some systems, the LC (uneccesarily) joins the 2 LANES (it is a requirement of most of the systems that the lanes are electrically connected, but this is also done by the digital power bases, and technically does not need to be done by the LCs as well)

2) where the LCs have a flipper, the flipper is sometimes non-conductive, and never does it join both RAILS of a lane at the same time

3) we are talking here of the shorting of the 2 rails causing an overload, not shorting of the 2 lanes

 

[darainbow]

QUOTE (astro @ 16 Dec 2004, 02:45)QUOTE (Skeeter @ 16 Dec 2004, 01:02)doesnt the LC short the slot anyway, thats y u cant run analogue power on a track with a LC?
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

no

1) it looks like in some systems, the LC (uneccesarily) joins the 2 LANES (it is a requirement of most of the systems that the lanes are electrically connected, but this is also done by the digital power bases, and technically does not need to be done by the LCs as well)

2) where the LCs have a flipper, the flipper is sometimes non-conductive, and never does it join both RAILS of a lane at the same time

3) we are talking here of the shorting of the 2 rails causing an overload, not shorting of the 2 lanes
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


I suspect the lanes are connected at the LCs for better power delivery. While they dont need to be, my carrera system requires a surprising number of power taps. Figure four cars may be running on the same lane within a few feet.

 

[SinclairZX81]

QUOTE (Skeeter @ 16 Dec 2004, 00:10)if your using something with electric, you have to expect errors and shortages and stuff. its all a part of racing
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Which is exactly why Scalextric should have taken it into account and preserve the current race information, so the race can be continued after the problem is resolved.

This brings up something I have said elsewhere as well; what, if any are Scalextric's plans for firmware/software updates? This is exactly the sort of early design error that should be fixed with a simple download. Here's an area where Ninco could gain points if they make it clear that a software based upgrade path is available with their system. This would show an understanding of the nature of the digital beast.

Darainbow - Do you get the impression that Carrera understand that knowledgeable digital buyers have these kinds of expectations?

(Funnily enough, as I typed this Software Update sprung up in my dock to tell me that an OS X update was available)

 

[darainbow]

QUOTE (SinclairZX81 @ 16 Dec 2004, 04:13)QUOTE (Skeeter @ 16 Dec 2004, 00:10)if your using something with electric, you have to expect errors and shortages and stuff. its all a part of racing
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>
Darainbow - Do you get the impression that Carrera understand that knowledgeable digital buyers have these kinds of expectations?
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

I get the impression that Carrera has kept their system simple to avoid problems such as these.

For instance, DC power is fed directly to the rails which enables the use of aftermarket supplies. Also, the coded guide flag makes it possible for aftermarket software to be used to count cars.

The black box only does a few things, but it does them very well. It has a single "start" button. Push once for ready, push again to start the LED sequence. It monitors inputs and effectively communicates false starts. There is an output (input?) labelled "lapcounter" so there may be a way to integrate with a computer or additional hardware, but for now its very simple.

I like the simple approach because it is more modular. When I upgrade to computer lapcounting software, Im not stuck with the cheap toy built into the power terminal. I think scalextric has made it more of a video game.

 

[astro]

QUOTE (darainbow @ 16 Dec 2004, 03:33)I think scalextric has made it more of a video game.
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

or scalextric has made a PS2 compared to carreras atari tennis?

only kidding!

 

[SWoRd]

Hi ZX
QUOTE (SinclairZX81 @ 16 Dec 2004, 04:13)Which is exactly why Scalextric should have taken it into account and preserve the current race information, so the race can be continued after the problem is resolved.There's really no excuse for not doing this!.

QUOTE This brings up something I have said elsewhere as well; what, if any are Scalextric's plans for firmware/software updates? This is exactly the sort of early design error that should be fixed with a simple download. Here's an area where Ninco could gain points if they make it clear that a software based upgrade path is available with their system. This would show an understanding of the nature of the digital beast.Don't panic

... we'll design our own solution, that solves all these issues.

The Atmel ATmega32 processor I've chosen, has a built in feature for self programming. You can make a bootloader in a small section of the program memory, that will allow you to update the rest of the program memory in runtime.

Base station software updates could be done via the RS232 PC interface, and perhaps be a feature in the open source PC program, we ought to develop along with the embedded hardware.

To infinity and beyond!

Søren

 

[darainbow]

QUOTE (SWoRd @ 16 Dec 2004, 18:30)Hi ZX
QUOTE (SinclairZX81 @ 16 Dec 2004, 04:13)Which is exactly why Scalextric should have taken it into account and preserve the current race information, so the race can be continued after the problem is resolved.There's really no excuse for not doing this!.

QUOTE This brings up something I have said elsewhere as well; what, if any are Scalextric's plans for firmware/software updates? This is exactly the sort of early design error that should be fixed with a simple download. Here's an area where Ninco could gain points if they make it clear that a software based upgrade path is available with their system. This would show an understanding of the nature of the digital beast.Don't panic

... we'll design our own solution, that solves all these issues.

The Atmel ATmega32 processor I've chosen, has a built in feature for self programming. You can make a bootloader in a small section of the program memory, that will allow you to update the rest of the program memory in runtime.

Base station software updates could be done via the RS232 PC interface, and perhaps be a feature in the open source PC program, we ought to develop along with the embedded hardware.

To infinity and beyond!

Søren
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Are you planning on making your system commercially available?

 

[SWoRd]

QUOTE (darainbow @ 16 Dec 2004, 19:27)Are you planning on making your system commercially available?I wasn't planning on it, but if I'm not swamped with requests, I would be willing to sell some systems (provided I'll get all expences covered).

The cost of components, boards and assembly are very dependant on the quantities involved, and I have no idea, if there's any interest for a system like this (besides a couple of slot nerds

)????.

Anyway, I'll be happy to help if it won't cost me anything.

Best regards
Søren

 

[EvilChuckie]

QUOTE (SWoRd @ 17 Dec 2004, 05:48)QUOTE (darainbow @ 16 Dec 2004, 19:27)Are you planning on making your system commercially available?I wasn't planning on it, but if I'm not swamped with requests, I would be willing to sell some systems (provided I'll get all expences covered).

The cost of components, boards and assembly are very dependant on the quantities involved, and I have no idea, if there's any interest for a system like this (besides a couple of slot nerds

)????.

Anyway, I'll be happy to help if it won't cost me anything.

Best regards
Søren
<{POST_SNAPBACK}>


Hi Søren just jupped over fron the other digital post, I know I am a long way away but just yell if you need help

I will send you a PM

 

[SWoRd]

QUOTE (kcelectronics @ 17 Dec 2004, 18:21)Hi Søren just jupped over fron the other digital post, I know I am a long way away but just yell if you need help

I will send you a PM

Thank's a lot

Søren