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Gary Skipp
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6,541 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi everyone

For CSCRA and similar retro racing and scartchbuild events, pretty much all racing takes place on wood. How do people feel about racing on plastic? If an event was organised on a plastic track would this deter you in anyway? If so, why?

Opinions and comments appreciated.
 

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John Roche
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4,264 Posts
Hi Gary,

I have only had limited experience of racing on plastic track and it hasn't been good. The only Ninco track I've raced on is bumpy. The Carrera track used in Bordeaux for the 1:32nd class has very irregular power although Turin is a little better. I guess the track would put me off if I didn't enjoy other aspects, i.e. we are racing vintage slots which is my favourite and the meetings are good socially.

I guess what I'm saying is that the meeting would have to be something special to get me to enter particularly with such a crowded calendar. In fact I'm planning to do less meetings next year.

Cheers

John
 

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David Collins
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2,467 Posts
Hi Gary,

There's nothing to stop a club (or individual for that matter) organising an event to CSCRA rules on a plastic track. Whether the retro racers would be interested in racing on say, a Ninco circuit, would be down to individiual choice.

It would be interesting to know how well brass chassis would work on a bumpier track - it might be that HRS-type chassis would have an advantage. Some of the experts here must know the answer to this!

Ultimately, it's down to someone to organise a race and see what the response is.

David
 

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Ric Woods
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817 Posts
I race on plastic more than wood anyway, but some plastic tracks can be very (in fact too) bumpy and are best avoided, though CSCRA cars might fare better, usually being a bit heavier. The biggest problem I have found is that the power on most plastic club tracks is far short of that which is required by yer average CSCRA car, with many tracks boasting around 1 amp per lane, or so. Some nice flat Carrera with decent power would be fine, I reckon.

Mooster
 

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Registered
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538 Posts
What about magnet traction?
There are CSCRA rules that traction magnets must be removed from ready to run classes, but I've not spotted anything about
traction magnets in scratch built cars. Perhaps I've missed something?
What about the motors with a lot of external magnetic field, apparently these are produced to get round "no traction magnet" rules by getting plenty of magnetic attraction from the motor.

Of course it's not difficult to add a rule or two.
 

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provider of comestables
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833 Posts
Hi Scale models slot racing are running 50's GP on a plastic track with all if not most using Penelope Pit lane chassis. Racing is proving to be close fast and entertaining with it being described as an exciting race class gaining favour. Our power supplies however struggle to supply the big amps used in some of the competition cars i have raced against at Donnington Wolverhampton or Brooklands.
 

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Premium Member
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2,980 Posts
Hi Gary,
I'd give it a go unless it was on Scalex Classic or SCX track.
As others have said, you will need to ensure there is adequate power available.
The biggest issue will be magnatraction.
As we, usually, only race on wood tracks with copper braid the issue has never come up before.
I would suggest you have a 'local rule' on this and have a magnet marshal available to test all cars.
Cheers.
****.
 

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Registered
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4,155 Posts
Hi Gary.
I would not go to a Ninco track event with a 'proper' scratch (metal chassis) model. I think Carrera is the way to go, you could run an CSCRA event on a well powered up Carrera track and it would run near as good as wood. If you tried to run on Ninco, you would have most of the entry on plastic chassis HRS and the like. Magnatraction would be a big issue on the raised rails as well.I would not even think about running on the old SCX/Classic scalex track...to many problems to start to list!
Regards Bill.
 

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Phil Smith
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4,534 Posts
Bordeaux, Turin and Flanders all run 1/32 on plastic track, all Carrera.
The problem with power loss is only apparent at Bordeuax due too a lack of cabling I guess.
Any other track than Carrera would be no good and personally I would not attend a meeting run on any other plastic track, sorry Southend (Ninco) that's why I haven't been back

Yes you do get magnatraction if you use an open frame motor, but not allowing Neo magnets levels this off to some extent.
 

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538 Posts
Lack of power sounds like a real problem on some plastic tracks.
It would be reasonable to expect meeting organisers to say what current their track could supply up front. That way competitors could turn up with motors that would run properly on that much current (or not waste a journey if their cars wouldn't run properly on that much current.)
Maybe a recommended minimum in CSCRA rules would help? Guess some classes would need different levels. I guess its only the 1/32 CSCRA classes that we are talking about for plastic track, the 1/24 D3 regs allow some rather higher current motors than would be suitable for the 1/32 CSCRA classes.
 

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mac pinches
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2,154 Posts
What it comes down to is what type of meeting is being presented.
If its an easy going fun type meeting then various plastic tracks are usable and the
faults with these circuits, ie power drops, track irregularity and such are excepted then a
reasonable days racing can be had.
If a more formal or serious open meeting is the idea, then these irregularities become
a problem and scratch built cars can be affected adversely with one or more of these faults.
and reduces the meeting to a bit of a lottery.
After building a car to what one thinks should be competitive finds that it is held back by
a problem other than the car tends to take the shine off the meeting.
The older, taller, slim tyred GP cars do suffer more than a more modern car with a wider tyre.
When Wolves where at Strykers, we ran on a 6 lane classic plastic track and the International
circuit.
I used the plastic circuit to run in tyres with scratch built cars, but when the same car was run
on the International circuit the car became a different animal.
As mentioned above, with the metal rails, magnatraction rears its head.
Lowering the motor mounts, tilting motors and the like have all been used from time to time.
This means the cars have to be monitored more closely {more rules ] if a flat playing field is
to be had.
I think it can be generally said that the greater % of scratch/classic builders run on flat wooden
circuits and the cars are built to give a good performance on these tracks, i fear, as John has
stated, there would be a fall off of entrants if too many meetings where given over to plastic
circuits.
Mac P
 

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Gary Skipp
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6,541 Posts
Discussion Starter · #12 ·
Thank you gentlemen for your input so far.

Would I be right in thinking that the examples of irregular power are on non-permanent tracks?

John, I feel the crowded calanders are a problem for everybody irrespective of what type of cars or tracks we indulge ourselves with. This is the strongest deterent for me when I have thought about organising an event. I feel that (scale) slot car racing in this country is treading the line between a casual/unorganised hobby and the necessity for a little more governance when it comes how, what, why and where some of our events take place. A whole new can of worms, a wholly un-managable topic for a chaotic public forum, and I don't think anyone wants to think about crossing that line anyway.

As we were, plastic tracks and soforth..
 

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Martin De Ath
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1,440 Posts
Hi there Gary (LMP).

I built and raced various Scratchbuilt cars, (early Saloons and Sport/GTs) for Petes (scudbong) excellent Tendring/Colchester/Essex, event earlier this year.

Their club uses a 4 lane plastic Carrera layout. I did not build the cars any different, to building them for a wooden track layout (with the possible exception as to tyre make) and they performed very well, non magnet of course.

But saying that, from previous experience of other plastic tracks, I am sure if the track had been any other make other than Carrera, I am sure the cars would not have performed as well..

If plastic track needs to, or has to be used, then given a choice it would be Carrera.. It makes as near to a wooden track as you can get, without being wooden.

Just make sure the power is consistant throught the layout, using power taps around the track.

All the best.. Martin De'Ath.
 

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QUOTE (LMP @ 26 Sep 2010, 10:36) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Would I be right in thinking that the examples of irregular power are on non-permanent tracks?
I've seen power problems on permanent and non-permanent tracks, on plastic and wood tracks.

Well organised clubs have usually sorted out these problems long ago for the type of cars they race. There can be problem when attempting to race higher current motors than the club is used to.
The wooden tracks used for CSCRA racing are normally used for at least the motors used in CSCRA racing, often they are also used for more powerful motors. As these are well organised clubs, power isn't a problem.
There's an example above of a well organised club using plastic track that say they do have a problem with the higher current CSCRA motors.

There are two separate problems, there are lots of slot forum threads on these problems, but briefly the problems are
1 The power supply itself
2 The wiring and track joints between the power supply and the car.
The car will have power problems unless both are done properly.

Continuity at track joints can be a problem with plastic track.
Non-permanent tracks are more prone to continuity problems .

Of course there are tracks where all this is a non-problem, but if it is a problem it is not the work of a moment to fix it.
 

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Hi, I race at Scalemodels running the gp class on sport track and the track surface doesn't cause much problem's, main complaint is lack of brakeing with the scaly slimline's were useing as it's our first attempt at raceing this class of car's ( non mag ofcourse ). Are club transformer's were used with our wood track at Donnington ( 2.5 amp each lane ) for the GP raceing and Iam not aware of any complaint's due to power problem's ( track surface yes ) but I was noticeing the higher draw of some of the car's so what would be your amp minimum be. phil.
 

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Registered
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463 Posts
Hi, I race at Scalemodels running the gp class on sport track and the track surface doesn't cause much problem's, main complaint is lack of brakeing with the scaly slimline's were useing as it's our first attempt at raceing this class of car's ( non mag ofcourse ). Are club transformer's were used with our wood track at Donnington ( 2.5 amp each lane ) for the GP raceing and Iam not aware of any complaint's due to power problem's ( track surface yes ) but I was noticeing the higher draw of some of the car's so what would be your amp minimum be. phil.
 
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