Scalextric Conundrum
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QUOTE Sure a Modern F1 car does not look right fishtailing round the track
You guys obviously havn't been watching the Minardis and Jordans in qualifying then.
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You guys obviously havn't been watching the Minardis and Jordans in qualifying then.
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My point exactly Al - Maybe those two teams need to look at magna traction.
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Its OK GRAH1 because everybody will have one who runs with a Scalextric Digital set up so the same set up opportunity is available to all.
Lets be very honest about this. The sole purpose of using a "weird" analogue control system at a club is to gain an advantage over racers who don't. That is the bottom line.
They should only be permitted in "open rule" club racing where anything goes.
Clearly they should not be permitted in any sort of event where the new Vintage F1 Scalextric cars are used and I would suggest that vintage low tech Scalextric controllers should be the order of the day, as well as goggles, scarf, leather gloves and vintage head gear to provide the right type of atmosphere. Also real ale rather than this chemical stuff drunk by the yooth of today.
Thinking about it though some of those boxes are so big they could contain old fashioned valves rather than transisters and also they look like WWII B17 Bomber Bomb Drop Buttons so maybe they could be permitted like this one:-
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or this complete with bomb!:-
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If I made one up I would have 20 or so dummy switches and stick it in a big dummy box to which I would attach a body harness to help support it to really frighten people! From a psychological point of view I could win every race as competitors would not even bother to compete so every race would become a lap of honour!
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I can but dream.
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Moped
Lets be very honest about this. The sole purpose of using a "weird" analogue control system at a club is to gain an advantage over racers who don't. That is the bottom line.
They should only be permitted in "open rule" club racing where anything goes.
Clearly they should not be permitted in any sort of event where the new Vintage F1 Scalextric cars are used and I would suggest that vintage low tech Scalextric controllers should be the order of the day, as well as goggles, scarf, leather gloves and vintage head gear to provide the right type of atmosphere. Also real ale rather than this chemical stuff drunk by the yooth of today.
Thinking about it though some of those boxes are so big they could contain old fashioned valves rather than transisters and also they look like WWII B17 Bomber Bomb Drop Buttons so maybe they could be permitted like this one:-
or this complete with bomb!:-
If I made one up I would have 20 or so dummy switches and stick it in a big dummy box to which I would attach a body harness to help support it to really frighten people! From a psychological point of view I could win every race as competitors would not even bother to compete so every race would become a lap of honour!
I can but dream.
Moped
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QUOTE I can but dream.
Some might say you do...
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Some might say you do...
Arrgh!
Looks like I'm going to have to drag this old chestnut out again. There's nothing "weird" about the analogue control boxes sprouting from the ends of various Parma controllers and homebuilts! In the main the boxes can and do protect the cars form the infamous AC ripple found on those tracks using unregulated power suppiles. Also, I see nothing wrong in being able to set the amount of braking force and "trigger response" when accelerating. After all a Professor motor controller does this for you (if you have the optional brake pot added). Whilst the throttle response curve may not be to your taste, the PM controller endeavours to retain that particular curve, whichever car you place on the track. The analogue boys just have to fiddle it out for themselves. One more thing, these black boxes don't give you a power increase - if the track is 13.8V regulated, then that is what your little car gets up its jacksy on full throttle - NO MORE.
I still use a Parma 25 ohm controller - mainly because I haven't yet got off my fat arse and bought the bits from Maplins or CPC! Or indeed not bought a PM controller yet.
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Mark.
Looks like I'm going to have to drag this old chestnut out again. There's nothing "weird" about the analogue control boxes sprouting from the ends of various Parma controllers and homebuilts! In the main the boxes can and do protect the cars form the infamous AC ripple found on those tracks using unregulated power suppiles. Also, I see nothing wrong in being able to set the amount of braking force and "trigger response" when accelerating. After all a Professor motor controller does this for you (if you have the optional brake pot added). Whilst the throttle response curve may not be to your taste, the PM controller endeavours to retain that particular curve, whichever car you place on the track. The analogue boys just have to fiddle it out for themselves. One more thing, these black boxes don't give you a power increase - if the track is 13.8V regulated, then that is what your little car gets up its jacksy on full throttle - NO MORE.
I still use a Parma 25 ohm controller - mainly because I haven't yet got off my fat arse and bought the bits from Maplins or CPC! Or indeed not bought a PM controller yet.
Mark.
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Could somebody provide a list of bits and instructions so that we can all make one?
And I don't want to use a soldering iron. Just a screwdriver please.
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Moped
And I don't want to use a soldering iron. Just a screwdriver please.
Moped
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5,015 Posts
QUOTE If I made one up I would have 20 or so dummy switches and stick it in a big dummy box to which I would attach a body harness to help support it to really frighten people
Sorry that you have a fear of the size of it mope
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but all the details have been available on my website and the bscra web for every one to see and build if they want one for a couple of years,we have 12 yr old kids building there own at preston and turning in 6.5 second magnet free laps so it aint rocket science or cheatin.try it you might wish you had earlier might help you to understand the reason isnt just to get an advantage .At wolverhampton last year I left my controler at home used a 40 yr old mrrc barrel and finished 10th out of 50 and top proslot runner ,I wasnt as comfortable using this as my regular handle but I still ended up with probably as good a finish as I would have using the electronic ,but I dont have to carry a box full of different resitance controlers round to venues around the country ,makes sense to me
Sorry that you have a fear of the size of it mope
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265 Posts
The beauty of the P.M. controller is that needing several controllers becomes unnecessary. Financially a wash, as one device serves for many.
Cheers!
Cheers!
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5,970 Posts
A while back, somebody - cannot recall who - said Hornby cars weren't good without magnets.
Sorry, but in my recent experience (MG Lola, Renault F1, Caterham, Corvette, Mustang,...) they are great without magnet having straight axles and round wheels, something SCX and Fly (who I love too) struggle to provide consistently.
Finally, what is all this "look's right" and "accurate handling" guff - they are toy cars!
[action]takes cover in nuclear shelter (with slot car set, obviously)[/action]
Scott
Sorry, but in my recent experience (MG Lola, Renault F1, Caterham, Corvette, Mustang,...) they are great without magnet having straight axles and round wheels, something SCX and Fly (who I love too) struggle to provide consistently.
Finally, what is all this "look's right" and "accurate handling" guff - they are toy cars!
[action]takes cover in nuclear shelter (with slot car set, obviously)[/action]
Scott
QUOTE (Swissracer @ 23 Apr 2004, 09:45)Sure a Modern F1 car does not look right fishtailing round the track but also an Old Vanwall would not look right screaming round the track at a scale 600 MPH, glued to the track !
Amen to that.
And, if you think about it, the only reason the modern F1 will fishtail (or exhibit "tail out cornering" as Moped put it), without magnets fitted, is because the person controlling it isn't doing it very well.
The fastest way around any corner is at the absolute limit of adhesion, a limit which Michael Schumacher is very good at judging. But even he has to slow down for all but the slightest bends. Too fast and, depending how he reacted at the time, he would either go straight on or the back end would break away. He might catch it, HE probably would, but chances are it would spin right round.
A slot car can't do this! It will spin round so far and then bounce back after the guide gets to it's fullest travel, and, if the person in control keeps the power on, it will do it for quite a while. So for that sort of realism may I suggest a centrally mounted 360 degree rotating guide.
Sorry to those who find this patently obvious, but I hope this will convince those who seem to think that a car is out of control (or uncontrollable) unless it is fitted with magnets.
As the saying goes
" the most dangerous component of a car is the nut behind the steering wheel"
Mr.M
Amen to that.
And, if you think about it, the only reason the modern F1 will fishtail (or exhibit "tail out cornering" as Moped put it), without magnets fitted, is because the person controlling it isn't doing it very well.
The fastest way around any corner is at the absolute limit of adhesion, a limit which Michael Schumacher is very good at judging. But even he has to slow down for all but the slightest bends. Too fast and, depending how he reacted at the time, he would either go straight on or the back end would break away. He might catch it, HE probably would, but chances are it would spin right round.
A slot car can't do this! It will spin round so far and then bounce back after the guide gets to it's fullest travel, and, if the person in control keeps the power on, it will do it for quite a while. So for that sort of realism may I suggest a centrally mounted 360 degree rotating guide.
Sorry to those who find this patently obvious, but I hope this will convince those who seem to think that a car is out of control (or uncontrollable) unless it is fitted with magnets.
As the saying goes
" the most dangerous component of a car is the nut behind the steering wheel"
Mr.M
QUOTE And, if you think about it, the only reason the modern F1 will fishtail (or exhibit "tail out cornering" as Moped put it), without magnets fitted, is because the person controlling it isn't doing it very well.
100% support from the Tropi corner.
Trouble is that 'thinking about it', poses an insuperable problem in some cases!
it doesn't matter how ANY car is set up, if the driver is incapable of driving within the car's limits, no matter how incredibly high those limits may be, then it will exceed them and it WILL go off the track. This applies to all vehicles and it is a tribute to the skill of F1 drivers that it happens so relatively rarely, but it DOES happen.
100% support from the Tropi corner.
Trouble is that 'thinking about it', poses an insuperable problem in some cases!
it doesn't matter how ANY car is set up, if the driver is incapable of driving within the car's limits, no matter how incredibly high those limits may be, then it will exceed them and it WILL go off the track. This applies to all vehicles and it is a tribute to the skill of F1 drivers that it happens so relatively rarely, but it DOES happen.
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3,627 Posts
QUOTE The new Scalextric Digital and SPORT World controllers will make all this talk redundant as you will be able to set the controller up as you want to give you a "classic" feel to your car if that is desired.
In fact all other controllers become redundant once the Scalextric Digital and SPORT World control systems are released as they will have infinitely variable multiphase settings.
To say that all other controllers become redundant seems rather silly. Yes, it seems that the Sport World set up will offer feartures and flexibility not found elsewhere, and so will possibly be able to claim that they are the most advanced available.
But the statement seems to hold the belief that everyone will simply abandon their tried and trusted controllers in favour of the new system. I don't see that happening, especially not in clubs. Scalextric will still have to compete in the controller market, same as anyone else. Maybe they will become widely respected and sought after, maybe not. But it's a bit premature to be talking about redundancy.
Back to the original point - Vintage F1's. Are we talking about what we would wish for in an ideal world, or what we expect.
I think it's unrealistic to expect Scalextric to provide anything other than their standard motor and magnet set up, probably a bar magnet, maybe a stepped one as in the Lister LMP.
I think it is reasonable to expect things like round wheels, straight axles and reliable gears. Once the manufacturers get this consistently right, maybe things like appropriate handling characteristics can be explored.
I also think that an out of the box car is expected to run reasonably well on plastic track. But it's ultimate performance and handling are down to me. If every car came out of the box performing exactly how I wanted it I think I'd get a bit bored. Tinkering and 'improving' a car are important parts of the hobby to me.
Sorry this is a bit of an epic, I'll stop now!
Rob
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In fact all other controllers become redundant once the Scalextric Digital and SPORT World control systems are released as they will have infinitely variable multiphase settings.
To say that all other controllers become redundant seems rather silly. Yes, it seems that the Sport World set up will offer feartures and flexibility not found elsewhere, and so will possibly be able to claim that they are the most advanced available.
But the statement seems to hold the belief that everyone will simply abandon their tried and trusted controllers in favour of the new system. I don't see that happening, especially not in clubs. Scalextric will still have to compete in the controller market, same as anyone else. Maybe they will become widely respected and sought after, maybe not. But it's a bit premature to be talking about redundancy.
Back to the original point - Vintage F1's. Are we talking about what we would wish for in an ideal world, or what we expect.
I think it's unrealistic to expect Scalextric to provide anything other than their standard motor and magnet set up, probably a bar magnet, maybe a stepped one as in the Lister LMP.
I think it is reasonable to expect things like round wheels, straight axles and reliable gears. Once the manufacturers get this consistently right, maybe things like appropriate handling characteristics can be explored.
I also think that an out of the box car is expected to run reasonably well on plastic track. But it's ultimate performance and handling are down to me. If every car came out of the box performing exactly how I wanted it I think I'd get a bit bored. Tinkering and 'improving' a car are important parts of the hobby to me.
Sorry this is a bit of an epic, I'll stop now!
Rob
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265 Posts
The "best" is whatever works well and satisfies the user. This applies across the board in much of life. That explains the myriad approaches to just about every task or problem or process..... Some people like having five controllers for their cars, some have sought out a single device to use for all, some like the driving with magnets, some do not. These are all approaches to our having fun in this corner of the universe. Try not to take this hobby too seriously. We race and drive in the "twilight zone". Seeking that "total immersion" as the cars run well around the circuit is reason enough to obsess the details. I try to keep it in perspective, I do it for fun. I'll suffer any and all fools or geniuses as I progress to slot car "sageliness". One day the kids will think I am the "guru of the groove" and I shall do my best to pollute them with the fine "disease" of slot car racing. I believe if I keep at it I will be able to fool them all!!!!!
The blessings of the plastic.
The blessings of the plastic.
Attainment of ultimate 'Slot Sagacity' could earn the title of "Slot City Sage"!
Which reminds me - I wonder if any dealers have any inkling as to the set up of these cars?
I'd take a guess that these cars are going to come with a small disc mag of some sort, which is ok with me as long as it's easy to remove and, if necessary, replace.
Which reminds me - I wonder if any dealers have any inkling as to the set up of these cars?
I'd take a guess that these cars are going to come with a small disc mag of some sort, which is ok with me as long as it's easy to remove and, if necessary, replace.
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