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Bill
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Now for something completely different. So I'm starting to plan seriously for a single lane hill climb with a snowy theme--obviously inspired by Monte Baldo. I'd like to make it with a small footprint so that it will be semi-portable. I'm thinking about 2.5'x8' (i.e., .8m x 3m). I'm curious about two things: 1) how tricky/dependable will the electrical be for a single lane analogue loop, and 2) how much incline can reasonably be put into this tentative plan? I'm hoping to get a rather radical ascent, at least 3-4 feet (1-1.5 m). Will that be possible? Graham seems to have quite an ascent in his track; I'll be interesting to see how it runs.

 

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Very exciting project!!!! I decided to start something in a similar footprint (2' x 10.5) but I took the coward's way out (no electicals) using two-lane track with a rally loop at each end. It's great to see more of these kinds of layouts develop as the scenic possibilities are great and the space requirement is relatively small. I'm looking forward to seeing how you tackle a winter scene...those Tarn Model Foundry figures are certainly dressed for that kind of weather!!!
 

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Wow, another exciting project from Bill!!!!!
Tag this guys!

Although my valley isn't operational yet, so I have yet to prove my theories, here they are based on my experience with the hairpins on my race track:
  • Minimum radius for a hairpin 24cm.
  • Keep the elevation in the corners to a minimum, 1-2cm, and use the straights to gain height.
  • Make the hairpins 14-15 cm wide and keep the slot close to the inside edge, say 3cm, but put a longish car on the corner and measure the tail swing and distance to the inside edge.
  • Use 6mm MDF as it seems to give the right flex.
  • Use plywood on edge for supports running right across the width of each piece of track.
Looking at the videos on Johno's track this seems to stack up as his cars often jerk to a stop midway round a hairpin and he has trouble with deslots.

Driving a rally circuit is not about going as fast as possible without deslotting. It's about driving, trying not to hit walls and obstacles, lining up for a descent and not getting it crossed up, and lowering your speed to get the maximum grip.

For track support consider using two 'stairs' with irregular treads, side by side and offset from each other, instead of a slope. This will make it easier to support each corner (on a tread) and create the elevations between. You've got to try and think in 3D. Dry-build your track with blocks of wood with clamps and bricks to hold it in place. Look at it from all angles and imagine driving it. Then measure the heights and cut your supports to suit. I'm a big fan of the plywood box construction that I have used on my track. It's light, rigid, and cheap.
 

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Bill
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Discussion Starter · #7 ·
QUOTE (lavenlaar @ 15 May 2008, 20:59) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Do you really need straights that long ? nearly 2mt in length each ???That's a good question. Of course, the straights are where I will put most of the grade in the elevation (as Graham points out). I may end up with a slightly shorter "straights". This is, of course, just the initial sketch, but I have the sense that Monte Baldo is similar and it works okay.
 

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Bill
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Discussion Starter · #9 ·
QUOTE (knoath @ 15 May 2008, 18:56) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>G'Day Bill, check Johno's Hillclimb from here in Melbourne... there's info in there as to how he went about wiring for the loop.Thanks Dick. Johno's thread on the loop is a bit scary! It would be nice if Monte Baldo had some information on the wiring of their loop which looks like it may be using a dead strip, but it would probably be in German (and electrical-speak is hard enough to understand without trying to read it with my remedial German). I'm guessing that Monte Baldo is built by a commercial company in Germany--maybe they sell the required parts and information?
 

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Things I learnt from making my hill climb.

I definately agree with keeping the corners as flat as possible. Too much curving and cars can lose traction as they go around.

By using ninco guides with the springs and 4x4 cars or raid cars its not a problem and the cars stay on.
With a bit of practice I can nip up and down around the corners without drama now.

While the wiring looks a mess if you can understand the basics behind how a relay works its a fairly logical procedure. Do what I did and print out the diagram and take it into an electronics store and go "help".


In regards to hairpin radius and track size around the corners Ive found my outside radius is about right, though possibly a bit small as the cars come out of the corners as there are a few nicks on the fences. The corners are pretty tight but you can get past them ok if you drive at the right speed to fling the cars around.

The biggest issue I am having at the moment with my hill climb is the angle that the loop rejoins the track. Its too severe and as the car did its 180 it would hit the main track at the wrong angle and get stuck. Im still working on a fix and may have to redo the slot to reduce the angle that the loop rejoins at.

Another thing I found was how far the track stuck out from the hill. I probably made the hill too steep and after fixing the top to the hill by the time I got to the bottom it was sticking a fair out from the board.

I would probably try to avoid too long a straight to avoid the temptation of going to fast with all those hairpins coming up.

It was definately a big learning experience though and lots of fun to build and race on
 

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Bill
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Discussion Starter · #11 ·
QUOTE (lavenlaar @ 15 May 2008, 20:59) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Do you really need straights that long ? nearly 2mt in length each ???I've been giving more thought to this question, and also thinking about creating more variety in the plan. I came up with this alternative. It seems more varied than the last version. Happy to entertain other suggestions!

 

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I love the flow of the new design, Jim. It would be a real blast to drive.

I've actually booked flights to come over to the USA in October. Would the track be finished by then? Is New England anywhere near you?
 

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Bill
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Discussion Starter · #13 ·
QUOTE (Graham Lane @ 20 May 2008, 12:04) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>I love the flow of the new design, Bill. It would be a real blast to drive.

I've actually booked flights to come over to the USA in October. Would the track be finished by then? Is New England anywhere near you?I'm in Los Angeles--no where near New England, but you're welcome to visit the track(s). Not sure when I'll start or finish, but probably it would be done well before October.
 

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QUOTE (jmswms @ 20 May 2008, 20:12) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>I'm in Los Angeles--no where near New England, but you're welcome to visit the track(s). Not sure when I'll start or finish, but probably it would be done well before October.

It was a rhetorical question.
I guessed it was not new you but just wanted you to know how much I want to see your work.
If I can get the plane diverted, I will.
 

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QUOTE (Graham Lane @ 20 May 2008, 21:04) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>I love the flow of the new design, Jim. It would be a real blast to drive.
/ ... / Is New England anywhere near you?
Close, I'd think .. as close as Murmansk is to Umbria ..

Oh .. the track? Great, love that smooth, nice flow to it. A slight angle inwards [of the layout] on the straights and with more interfolding loops. That could also be, I believe, more appealing to the eye than the first version!

-- ron --
 

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Bill
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Discussion Starter · #18 ·
QUOTE (Graham Lane @ 20 May 2008, 21:39) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Bill, have you decided where this track is going to be based on? Do you have a theme?Not where, but I do want to try modeling snow. Italian or French Alps perhaps? Or, Pike's Peak? I'm open to suggestions.
 

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QUOTE Not where, but I do want to try modeling snow. Italian or French Alps perhaps? Or, Pike's Peak? I'm open to suggestions.

Cut the guide off the car and replace it with a pin located in the center of the car, cover the road surface with 'Future' floor wax, and let 'er rip.
 
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