[peter]

wow - I just read through the discussion about standards again. It is funny that some who are against standards seem to make a large number of assumptions. A couple of things to remember that my eventually come with the digital revolution (no matter what is 'promised' today). It is quite possible that:

1) only cars made by the manufacturer of the track that you have might run on that track.
2) only controllers made by the same...
3) only transformers made by the same...

In a few years it is quite possible that all manufacturers of track have their own (and with everyone else incompatible) digital systems and if the complexities of each system drastically change you might not even be able to make your own homemade cars to run...

I am not saying that this will happen - just a question of 'standard'. Remember that standards sometimes develop by tradition or coincidence not alway written down as regulated 'rules'. If anyone things that a development into incompatibility is impossible (based on thinking that companies are too smart etc?) you might want to study the digital revolution and the history of manufacture of computer technology to see a few examples...

I do think it would be a very good idea to support a body (organisation) that should invite participation of all major manufacturers. It is not about standardization of details like cars, motors etc - it is about standardization for interoperability. For example that 1/32 cars should be possible to run on 12 - 16 volt without problems, another example is that there would be some limits on how big the guide might be. This does not mean that track needs to be the same, but it could mean that the variables could be agreed upon. It does definitively mean that it would be a good idea to have a forum where manufacturers did have a dialogue about these issues.

That is what I think anyway...

regards
//peter

 

[astro]

good points peter. Standards on digital have been kicked about on here before. There is a big risk with imposing standards too early on a new development - should scalextric and carrera have just dropped their ideas and taken up SCX system cos they were first?

Of course, the winner may not be the most technologically best (VHS/Betamax), but manufacturers and developers do have to be able to experiment with the foundations of such a system before they are set in stone.

PS - those are my opinions based on the ideas kicked about elsewhere, not the unanimous voice of SF!

 

[jonny s]

I honestly believe that the manufacturers like being different and all believe they have a fan base and that they offer the best product based on their own agenda. When we as racers or collectors stick to one brand then the standardisation issue is a lot less troublesome. So racing just VMG Can Am cars in a one make series is no prob, the scale difference doesn`t matter. Racing Fly touring cars as a one make class , same answer doesn`t matter they are front motored. Of course we don`t do that and why should we but the down side is so many repeated cars and liveries it`s gettibng to breaking point.

As far as other aspects of this hobby go you only have to read a small selection of the posts here to gain an idea of how diverse we all are. I have taken part in a fair amount of inter club events and each event/club has different rules and even ideas on race format are different too. We had a reasonable debate about marshalling or crash and burn here and look how different we viewed that one aspect. We can`t agree on anything it would seem , even track surfaces. I first saw and used Scalextric Sport track when we made "Short Circuits". I couldn`t believe it and when I met Ben Collins he explained that they had designed it to the suggestions of many slot racers that Hornby had asked advice from. Well they didn`t ask the lads at my club and we don`t rate it at all. So what does that tell you? Well in my humble opinion it`s about choice and the up side is that you have options which helps to get what you want from the hobby and not what others may want you to get out of it. If you are happy with your own/your club approach to the hobby then that`s about as good as it gets. Unless a Slot Bernie Ecclestone appears on the scene I can`t see it changing much either

 

[masmojo]

10 Years from now?

1) There are several New manufacturers & a couple of current ones are gone!

2) Digital has come & gone due to incompatability between brands
or
Digital has been reduced to 1 major brand that is easily & cheaply adaptable to other brands or non-digital cars, possibly All systems are defunct , but a small # of fanatics continue to convert & race this unusual niche with home made control modules.

3) Strong aftermarket for replacing long out of production Fly & Scaley parts with higher quality spares. Adjustable Magnesium or carbon fiber frames that are straight bolt-ons to most fly/ Scaley/ Ninco cars!

4) Increased technological capacity creates the ability to make special runs of cars in the hundreds instead of thousands and still turn a profit. Cars/ measurements are scanned into a computer & a CNC machine rips out the molds in a matter of hours. Clubs order special series of cars that are made for each series they plan, with custom liveries based on historical precident & personal preferences.

5) The can motor is replaced with a planetary or modular motor (similar to the t-jet motors?), this allows full interiors on all cars & custom placement dictated by car type & model. Custom Armatures proliferate based on required torque top speeds of the different layouts.

6) Highly adjustable magnet systems adjustable with an allen key or similar tool will be STANDARD on ALL cars.

7) The bottom has fallen out of the collector/ special edition market due to older collectors ascending to the Goodwood in the sky. Their relations post large collections on Ebay & Mr. Pea snaps them all up at bargain basement prices.

8) Slot clubs turn into gentil clubby establishments, mandatory memberships, well stocked bars, personal lockers, Punch & Partagas available from the pretty lady at the cash register, non-stop classic videos of Le mans, Laguna Seca & Goodwood

9) Scale moderators hand out the right to use their exclusive seal on all models that merit their approval, the industry is rocked by charges of corruption as Fly Gt-40 10 year anniversay edition gets a seal!!!

OK maybe this is my personal vision of the future, but I did not get too carried away! I think just about everything mentioned is theoretically possible and/or probable.

 

[550rs]

Cars with onboard cameras front- and rear-facing.
Drivers can use pedals rather than handcontrollers and watch the camera output instead of at the car i.e. like driving sims.
Steering wheels to activate the lane changers.
All data able to be synchronised over the Net in near realtime also like online games.

Almost all of the pieces are available or soon will be so it just needs to be rolled into one easy to install package.

 

[Nico]

Hi,
I think that the cars will stay quite the same as today.

The digital story will have to settle and people will get used to it on bigger tracks or at endurance races (I am still asking you digital experts out there:".... have you raced a digital system yet to be able to tell us your experiences that well????"). Only one or two digital systems will survive.

But I think that there will be national organizations that are being formed, maybe something like a European championship coming up??!! For 1/32 and 1/24 scale.

The Flexi guys are well ahead on that one!!!!!!!!

Nico

Grenzlandslot

 

[Russell Sheldon]

I posted this elsewhere but it may be more appropriate in this thread.

I know that the technology needs to be fine-tuned, but is this the future?

1/43rd scale highly detailed R/C cars…..

"The DigiQFormula Car measures out at a miniscule 110 mm long - small enough that you can drive it easily about your home.

Other than the controller, no special equipment is required to operate the car, but using ordinary items found in your home you can design imaginative racing circuits and double your fun!

Each car comes with the Digi Propo Special controller enabling you to digitally adjust speed, acceleration, braking, steering and more. Program the car to suit your driving skills just like a real Formula 1 driver, then use the trigger accelerator and steering wheel to drive the car.

These cars are controlled with "Micro IR" technology. The radio sends out a infra-red beam to control the car. The IR receiver is placed right in front of the driver and sits low enough that it is not an eye-sore. There are 4 available "frequencies" so you can race your friends at the same time."

Could just kill off slot car racing. Why bother to go digital to overtake a car, when it can be done more realistically? You don't even need to have a track!

Just a thought.

Kind regards

Russell

 

[Difflock]

QUOTE (masmojo @ 10 Feb 2004, 06:00 AM)8) Slot clubs turn into gentil clubby establishments, mandatory memberships, well stocked bars, personal lockers, Punch & Partagas available from the pretty lady at the cash register, non-stop classic videos of Le mans, Laguna Seca & Goodwood
Now THAT I could get used to!!

Jim! About that oak panelling we need on the walls....

Mark.

 

[Rich T UK]

R/C has been failing to completely kill off slot racing for 25 years- smaller cars aren't going to finish the job.

Why? mostly because they aren't as much fun to drive in a race situation. Micro R/Cs are great fun to mess around with on a wide, smooth surface, but racng them around a track is very hard. because they're so small, it's very hard to aim them. they don;t run too well on carpet either, so you're restricted to smooth surfaces.

Slot racing's main advantage is that because the steering's done for you, all you have to do is play with the throttle, and this simplification gives a more satisfying drive- it's very rare indeed to get a drift going with a micro R/C car. also, the reception can be bad- particularly on the Digi-Qs (which are IR controlled)

I love my micro R/Cs (3 bit char-g and 1 standard Digi-Q), but they aren't a replacement for slot racing. I still want a Digi-Q formula 1 car- But I doubt it'll be raced. Messed around with on the kitchen floor, but not raced...

 

[Difflock]

QUOTE (Rich T UK @ 10 Feb 2004, 01:28 PM)Slot racing's main advantage is that because the steering's done for you, all you have to do is play with the throttle, and this simplification gives a more satisfying drive- it's very rare indeed to get a drift going with a micro R/C car. also, the reception can be bad- particularly on the Digi-Qs (which are IR controlled)
I agree. R/C racing, by it's very nature needs larger cars and hence more space. Trying to drift such a small wheelbased car would I suspect require MUCH quicker reactions than a 1:10 scale R/C buggy. I've raced these (indoor, off-road uses mini-pin tyres for carpet) for a while and I've still got my 4WD Tamiya Manta Ray. We got some great drifts going, but we needed a school sports hall to achieve them!!

Mark.

 

[cheater]

My feeling is that RC cars simply don't have the "fineness" of control that slot cars enjoy.

I can recall watching the ROAR Nationals when they were here in the Atlanta area a number of years ago and I recall thinking that no one had any consistency of line. And that there was no really head to head racing.

In slot racing, I have seen many, many times where two cars ran entire heats so closely that both could have been covered with a single washcloth.

 

[Xlot]

Rich T & Difflock,

Now, if only your posts could be memorized for reference, this would quickly settle the issue the next time "R/C vs. slot" comes up - which, statistically, should be this Friday

 

[soapy]

How about sound?

It seems like it wouldnt be too hard to put an onboard sound chip into the cars. I guess it is a matter of the manufacturers finding a cheap but cool implementation. I wonder how hard it would be to have different sound clips play according to voltage level, from rumbling idle up to full bore wail. Sound seems to me to be a cheap and easy fix that would add tons of realism. I wonder what the problem is?

 

[Fergy]

We've got a bunch of RC cars in this house

but the only one that was ever suitable for indoor use that gave good performance in a reasonable size was the 1/24 Tamiya Tamtech. Full proportional control, and superb looking cars! Great fun motoring that around a nice course on the basement floor! But... it just didn't work once you put a second or third or fourth car onto the track - there's just too much going on in RC to have close quarters racing that doesn't quickly (if not instantly) end in a crash or just plain look stupid with cars going all over the track trying to get past each other. And don't even think about scenery with RC!

Soapy, the sound issue doesn't work if you think about it for a bit. You couldn't have anything approaching realistic sound unless the cars were travelling at realistic, scale speeds. Slot cars are so fast that (as I said elsewhere) they would sound like full-race chipmunks on steroids. Better to just play some background sound CDs at low volume. Mood music!

 

[Intergrali]

QUOTE Better to just play some background sound CDs at low volume.

that include drum n bass stuff?

ie boom boom boom boom boom "oi turn that racket down" boom BOOM BOOM BOOM

 

[Fergy]

Whatever turns your crank! A little Led Zep or ZZ Top works just fine!

 

[soapy]

Ah Fergy, so you've tested it? You can say for certain it sounds like chipmunks on steroids? The scale speed only changes the time / distance relationship of the sound to your ear not the essential character of the sound. I dont think it would be that far out of whack. Moving the sound around the track more quickly does not speed up the sound as if it were a 33 record played at 78..

 

[Fergy]

Well, okay, no I haven't tested it. But it seems to me that if a slot car negotiates a typical long straight in say 1 second (2 at the very most with a slow car), then realistic sound can't be obtained. To vary the sound pitch from minimum to maximum in the space of 1 second would be most unrealistic. And gear changes would be out of the question because then you would be forced to go through multiple cycles of the min-to-max pitch. Picture a Formula One car going through 7 gears and then slowing for a turn and doing it all within one second.

I just don't see any way to incorporate sound in any realistic fashion.

 

[peter]

Carrera was supposedly doing something with car sounds as part of their RMS system. The sounds were to be recorded engine sounds of a number of vehicles and would adapt the engine revs according the slotcar controller. I like the idea of having the Carrera supercharged musclecars going for it soundwise while driving them on the track - have not tested it so I have no idea if it works well or not. Anyone got any experience of their system?

//peter

 

[Inside_Info]

In the year 2014, world leaders will realise that wars, terrorism and violence are futile and the only REAL way to solve their differences is by racing slot cars. The problems arise when all involved fail to agree on which of the myriad of Scalextric tracks to use, amongst others the choice is... Scalextric Classic, Super Classic, Sport, Super Sport, World Sport, Eurosport Digital, Isle of Wight digital, Isle of Wight digital Super Sport.... All other manufacturers have fallen by the wayside due to Aaron from Gaugemaster (Sorry Aaron!) listening to the suggestions of all the 675million 'SLOTFORUM' members and then passing the suggestions on to them... Reading the deluge of e-mails, they forget what their businesses are about and fail to produce any new cars... Fly finally realise their error and bring out two re-liveried Vipers, trouble is they fail to look through their archives and see it is identical to their very first offerings. Since the finding of major Gold, Diamond and Platinum reserves in a field in Rutland (a small English county), these minerals have been massively de-valued and the only items the money markets can deal in is the original Fly Vipers... Flys error in re-releasing them de-values every major stockmarket, leading to hysteria, panic buying and eventually mass poverty... in 2019 the real problems start... the worlds copper supply has been exhausted and there is no suitable alternative for making braids out of..... Then news gets out of a major copper find in another field in Rutland... The nations of the world unite and all decide to invade Rutland, using massive overwhelming force to free the copper mines from 'tyranny and oppression'...