[dannny]

Hi,

I have four cars (Carrera digital 132), two that come with the DTM Furore set (BMW M4 DTM and Audi RS 5 DTM), and two additional cars (Mercedes-AMG GT3 and Ferrari 488 GT3). The issue that I'm facing is that the DTM Furore cars run two times faster on the same speed settings. So, although all cars should be set to the same speed, the speed is different. In fact, if I set the speed to the maximum, it's impossible to drive them. One the other hand, the two additional cars are just fine (slow at the minimum, driveable on the maximum). So, is there any way how to slow down the DTM Furore cars? I checked the tires/wheels, and they are exactly the same.

Any help is appreciated.

Thanks.

 

[MrFlippant]

Have you compared magnet positioning and proximity to the rails?

 

[dannny]

Well, I haven't done any car disassembly to check it precisely, but it fells very similar if I put the cars on the rails. Do you think that the magnet can make such a difference in the speed?

Thanks.

 

[dannny]

So, I just compared two cars and it seems that they are fairly the same, position as well as strength of the magnet...

 

[MrFlippant]

It can make a pretty big difference, and different model years have different ways of handling the magnets. Sometimes there will shims you can use to alter the magnet traction. If they look visually the same, then that's a good start. Measuring by hand on track is ballpark, at best.

But, without more obvious differences, the speed differences are probably down to the motors in use, if everything else really is the same. Sometimes motors will be faster than others, especially from different batches, but even in the same batch. Carrera motors are not high end, high precision motors, so the variances can be sizeable.

Tires also make a big difference, especially when combined with magnet traction. Is it possible that the ones that are hard to control have poor traction due to harder tires?

If you haven't already done so, try scuffing all the cars' rear tires on some sandpaper to take off the shiny outer layer. This can be tricky when the cars have magnets, though.

 

[dannny]

Ok, so I disassembled the cars and looked at the internals. Here's what I found:

| | Mercedes-AMG GT3 | Ferrari 488 GT3 | Audi RS 5 DTM | BMW M4 DTM |
+----------+------------------+-----------------+--------------------+--------------------+
| Weight | 108 g | 110 g | 108 g | 106 g |
| Width | 64 mm | 64 mm | 62 mm | 62 mm |
| Height | 147 mm | 145 mm | 150 mm | 150 mm |
| Magnet 1 | 36x5 mm | 36x5 mm | 36x5 mm | 36x5 mm |
| Magnet 2 | 27x5 mm | 27x5 mm | 27x5 mm | 27x5 mm |
| Motor | No Name (v1.0) | No Name (v1.0) | E200 190506 (v1.0) | E200 190325 (v1.0) |
+----------+------------------+-----------------+--------------------+--------------------+

Note that the magnet system is the same, so no shims etc. The only difference I see is the motor and the the little difference in the size/weight, but it is not that big.

I'll do the tires surface improvements as well, but it solves the ride, not the fact that the two cars are significantly faster even if the speed setting is the same and I use the same controller...

 

[Slotspeed]

Have been waiting for this issue to come up here on the forum. There is a known issue with at least two (probably more) newer release (2018 and 2019) models with specific revision decoders that also have a different model of FET fitted. The end result is that these decoders have an EXTREMELY different and aggressive throttle response and do not respond well to the different speed levels as set on the CU. This issue has blown up on the Freeslotter forum and reportedly also on the Carrera club forum. I read on freeslotter that Carrera have acknowledged that they are aware of the issue (reportedly on Facebook, I assume to the German speaking audience). Its a very awkward time of year to expect any kind of immediate response to it but they say that they are looking into it. I wrote to the Carrera service email address about the issue but have heard nothing back. I expect communication will be slow at this time of year.

 

[Slotspeed]

Danny, what is the approximate date of manufacture of the Furore cars? The symptoms you describe (unable to adjust speed settings) certainly sound a lot like the reports here: (page 1 of 11) https://www.freeslotter.de/index.php?thread/93834-carrera-digital-132-decoder-ab-werk-neu-programmiert/&pageNo=1

 

[dannny]

Have been waiting for this issue to come up here on the forum. There is a known issue with at least two (probably more) newer release (2018 and 2019) models with specific revision decoders that also have a different model of FET fitted. The end result is that these decoders have an EXTREMELY different and aggressive throttle response and do not respond well to the different speed levels as set on the CU. This issue has blown up on the Freeslotter forum and reportedly also on the Carrera club forum. I read on freeslotter that Carrera have acknowledged that they are aware of the issue (reportedly on Facebook, I assume to the German speaking audience). Its a very awkward time of year to expect any kind of immediate response to it but they say that they are looking into it. I wrote to the Carrera service email address about the issue but have heard nothing back. I expect communication will be slow at this time of year.

I filled a ticket at the Carrera service mail as well, so I hope that they will respond to any of us

. The issue is that the decoder is quite expensive (almost a price of the car), so it's hard to do any experiments like buy a new one and try it...

 

[dannny]

Danny, what is the approximate date of manufacture of the Furore cars? The symptoms you describe (unable to adjust speed settings) certainly sound a lot like the reports here: (page 1 of 11) https://www.freeslotter.de/index.php?thread/93834-carrera-digital-132-decoder-ab-werk-neu-programmiert/&pageNo=1

I think that the code on the motor implies the year 2019. I'm sorry, but I cannot speak German, so it's hard to follow the freeslotter. I'll try some translator though...

 

[dannny]

Just found this http://slotbaer.de/carrera-digital-124-132/87-blaudek.html. It explains why the new cars are faster and "ignores" the speed setting. So, just for the record, it's about a new decoder and mosfet that is there. Unfortunately, there is no workaround at the moment. I hope that Carrera will release a new firmware for the new decoder soon. The last thing I want to do is swapping the mosfets by myself...

 

[MrFlippant]

Does the new decoder have a bootloader, or any way for a user to add code that is not something they would consider to be too risky (like we do with flashing firmware to SSD chips)? I would be amazed if they do. I expect if there is a "fix" it will involve returning chips to them for replacement.

 

[dannny]

Does the new decoder have a bootloader, or any way for a user to add code that is not something they would consider to be too risky (like we do with flashing firmware to SSD chips)? I would be amazed if they do. I expect if there is a "fix" it will involve returning chips to them for replacement.

Well, I'm not sure, but there is an atmel CPU on the decoder, so there should be JTAG interface for firmware update. The question is whether Carrera is willing to share the new firmware. I'm ok with the replacement as well. I hope that they will solve it soon. It's really unfortunate...

 

[Slotspeed]

Does the new decoder have a bootloader, or any way for a user to add code that is not something they would consider to be too risky (like we do with flashing firmware to SSD chips)? I would be amazed if they do. I expect if there is a "fix" it will involve returning chips to them for replacement.

There is nothing available from Carrera to do that, that is for sure.

 

[Slotspeed]

Just found this http://slotbaer.de/carrera-digital-124-132/87-blaudek.html. It explains why the new cars are faster and "ignores" the speed setting. So, just for the record, it's about a new decoder and mosfet that is there. Unfortunately, there is no workaround at the moment. I hope that Carrera will release a new firmware for the new decoder soon. The last thing I want to do is swapping the mosfets by myself...

Interesting info and clarifications from slotbaer.

Its going to be difficult for Carrera to resolve this.

Perhaps

1) return to local dealer/importer for repair in house

2) return to Carrera for factory repair/replacement

3) provide alternate/corrected firmware adjusted to the performance of the new FET - plus the tools to upload it.

 

[dannny]

I'm ok with anything. 1, 2, or 3 sounds good to me, definitely better than leave it as it is...

 

[dannny]

this video shws what the issue is about. Cars are set to the slowest speed, but one of them (with the new decoder) is crazy fast compared to the old one.

[youtube-hd]PfiU2arnH3g[/youtube-hd]

 

[MrFlippant]

Wow. That makes the speed control pretty much useless for those cars.

 

[Slotspeed]

Wow. That makes the speed control pretty much useless for those cars.

Yeah, they need to fix it. Promptly.

 

[Slotspeed]

Hello,

Watching this issue play out in the last few weeks over on freeslotter where the information on Carrera technology flows a little more freely.

This issue, according to a member there who claims to have an inside connection, officially has not been acknowledged by Carrera, either internally or externally, though there was a rumor that it had been acknowledged in the Carrera club forums, of which I am not a member so I cannot clarify.

The issue is, according to several accounts I have read, including some technical tests by Slotbaer, due to the gate input impedance characteristics of a new FET that has been installed affecting the duty cycle ON time of the FET on a new batch of decoders, I have not tested or confirmed for myself, but I have seen photos of affected decoders of a particular batch of the 26732 model decoder (blue screenprint PCB) and the FET controlling speed has been substituted at the manufacturing stage for an NCE brand equivalent. Looking at the circuit design I am surprised this is the case, but the published results of the PWM waveform that Slotbaer has published prove that this is the case.

Believe the original spec part was Alpha Omega brand, but other brands may have been used at different times.

Document on the freeslotter thread (pinned in the Carrera section) consisting of a warranty return slip by one of the members suggests the issue was resolved by reflashing the firmware with an adjusted version. The members there (at least three) who have received returns say that the chips now seem to be of the correct speed settings response.

So make your own conclusions but the fact that there have been three known returns and repairs for this issue should be enough to argue that the manufacturer knows of it, even if no official statement has been made. It seems that if you know the warranty return process that you can get your faulty decoder repaired.

Hope that helps anyone who is having the issue.