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SSD Racing Line Transplant

37878 Views 110 Replies 44 Participants Last post by  Orc Slayer, 
S
4
Ok first up i did a bit of cutting just to see how easy it was to make more of a racing line in my hairpin.

Actually the cutting of the track was pretty straight forward as was the cutting and transplanting of rails etc.

So long as you take a good think through what cuts and where before you grab the knife it goes smooth.

The options are endless from there, it is possible to make a neat enough job of this to perhaps drop a racing line in around the whole circuit, that is if you have a lot of time.

Next is fixing neatly into place the track pieces, i used different resin's to bond the track and rails. The resin works well as you can use it to fill any gaps and it can be sanded, trimmed down flush to the track surface.

I still have some holes to fill and shape up where the sensors are as i tried different places for them but the finnish product once layed filled and surface painted will be just fine.

http://www.slotforum.com/forums/uploads/11..._524_217024.jpg


Then the SENSORS.

Find and then make a nice place for them to sit, something like they were in the half straights that they came in. Trim the track underside it's a bit fiddly but pretty straight forward.
Well that all worked good, seemed almost to easy.

THEN
I concluded that with different cars and LED in different places on each and different amounts of slide it was always going to be hit and miss. A solution to increase LED hitting the sensor would be more sensors.

So for the second LC 'CLC.2' i decided to use both sensors on the sensor board and also a second sensor board. Giving me four sensors for 'CLC.2'. I placed them as per the pic below so that if the car LED went inside the inner R1 over the rail or drift wide on either the R1 or the new racing line it would hit a sensor.

All appeared good. With four sensors there are kinda 8 combo's so it took me a while to realize there was something not working.

After much testing i had the same problem with one side of each sensor board, it would do either a Change or a straight on but not both. The other side of the sensor board was good. It was different sides on each board, and a different action not working change or straight on each board for both CLC.2 and CLC.3


SO THE PROBLEM

The CLC comes with its Half Straight sensor track which has 2 sensors. I always figured that they were both FULLY operational (only one works due to the plug setup).
Therefore the sensor track would work with both Left and Right hand CLC's. ????
Did anyone else think this..??

I tested CLC.1 as it was still a basic set up using the Half Straight Sensor track. LH sensor all worked good open & close so i tried connecting RH sensor to CLC.1 just to see if it only had one function instead of 2. Results were i it would make a change but not a straight pass.

So how was i supposed to make both sensors on the board work and pass the current out through to the cable.??

I SUSPECT THIS MAY BE WHERE I HAVE GONE WRONG.

The female socket on the sensor board has 2 holes to connect to both Left & Right LC's the pic below shows how i have shorted this connection so as to take current from both sides.

RESULT: one of the sensors on each board only half works.

I know its not the flipper or power or solenoids as they all work when the other sensors switch them.




Any help on how to get both the sensors fully working.

Shaunbmx
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D
Well, I cant answer the question as such, but just want to say nice work Shaun. Great looking line, love the idea of skipping from lane 1 thru to lane 3.

edit..
Interstingly I think I have the same curve combo in my track (although reversed)....

OH no(!), u got me thinking...

have you tried merely plastic welding with tip of soldering iron to connect pieces?
I'man reckons it's magic (though a mask would be essential).
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R
2
QUOTE SO THE PROBLEM

The CLC comes with its Half Straight sensor track which has 2 sensors. I always figured that they were both FULLY operational (only one works due to the plug setup).
Therefore the sensor track would work with both Left and Right hand CLC's. ????
Did anyone else think this..??

I tested CLC.1 as it was still a basic set up using the Half Straight Sensor track. LH sensor all worked good open & close so i tried connecting RH sensor to CLC.1 just to see if it only had one function instead of 2. Results were i it would make a change but not a straight pass.

So how was i supposed to make both sensors on the board work and pass the current out through to the cable.??

I SUSPECT THIS MAY BE WHERE I HAVE GONE WRONG.

The female socket on the sensor board has 2 holes to connect to both Left & Right LC's the pic below shows how i have shorted this connection so as to take current from both sides.

RESULT: one of the sensors on each board only half works.

Hmm must be coming up to Christmas, have the seen the amount of digital posts this morning.
Like the layout a lot.


So to the problem. I agree on your both are fully operational theory. In fact they must both be fully operational as one half is used for a left lane change and the other for a right in normal operation.

First thing is to suss out why CLC.1 is not working when you swap the connections over. This one ought to be simple.

Have you tried it as a straight swap. No paralleling but just move the three wires to where they would be if it was a RH change?

It is possible that paralleling could cause problems. I have not spent much time looking at the LC circuit. Confirm the above which MUST work. If not I will take a look.

Rich
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S
Thanks Rich

I just parrallel connected the other side of CLC.1.

I will do some more tests today.

Drummer yep the plastic welding by melting the track works well, a bit smelly like you say.

shaunbmx
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injectorman
Ok Ive done this mod a while back, using 2 boards to operate 1 set of flippers. What happens is and I think whay may have happened to yours is when you use S2.b current also goes to the board S2.a and burns out part of the board. You need to employ diodes here, correct me if Im wrong RichG. What I did initially was to use 2 sets of solenoids on the one set of flippers. Then I bought some diodes and mucked around.
Look on the boards, you may be able to see where the board is damaged.
Then again it could also be a wiring mistake.
Cheers.
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Slotrace.dk
Why not just drop S2a?
This only means that the lastest direction from S2b will direct the car coming from the S2a route.

But impressive job!
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QUOTE (injectorman @ 1 Dec 2006, 12:28) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>when you use S2.b current also goes to the board S2.a and burns out part of the board. You need to employ diodes here, correct me if Im wrong RichG.

This makes sense to me, and a couple of diodes is probably the simplest fix. I will rip up a LC and have a look when I get a mo.

Rich
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S
Posty dropped of the new CLC.

Did some tests with new sensor track. Tested with 3x CLC's.
1. LH.. In to Out
2. LH.. Out to In
3. LH.. In to Out

Worked with all 3.

So it must be the way i am hooking up the sensor boards to receive current from both of the female sockets.

@Iman .. @ Rich G

I have a new board now and also diodes, i have a few types. Any is good right?

Where to place them.??,
I might just blow a board again so any help would be great.??

I will take a look see if i can see any damage.

@Slotrace.dk
Sensors S2a and S2b are for the different approach lanes for CLC.2.

If you wish not to change and the car hits say 2 sensors it will just send the signal to go straight to both the sensors.

If a car hits more than one of the sensors then it should just get the same signal as the sensors are all pretty close
You will have presses the change button before the LC as normal and it should still be pressed until you pass the LC.

The more sensors the better the chance of the track flippers getting your signal.

Thanks for the replies.

Shaunbmx
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3
OK I have had a look at the problem, and I can't get to the bottom of it. However this is what I have found.

Here is a quick sketch of the output stage that drives the solenoid. There are 4 of these.


The device had me baffled for a while as it has 6 legs.
Anyway it's marked 3A3 but turned out to be a ZXMN3A03E6 which is an N channel mosfet. Four of the legs are Drain connections and are joined.

So it is driven by the microcontroller though a 100 ohm resistor. The Source is grounded and the solenoid coil is in the Drain, the other side of the coil goes to 12V.

So to me it looks like it should be fine to parallel connect pairs of output stages. The mosfet is like a switch and it should not matter if one or both are on at the same time.

So I tried it first without the LC, but with 4 Led's in place of the coils. All OK. Then did the parallel connections, that was fine. Finally slotted the changer in, and that was also fine, working as one would expect.

So I am confused as to why yours do not work.


I'man did you try without diodes, or did you use them from the off?

Rich
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injectorman
Tried without diodes twice and twice burnt out one of the boards. So Rich you had two boards driving one set of solenoids? For me it worked for a couple of gate changes, then gave up the ghost, which confused me even more.
Cheers.
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R
Interesting on the diodes. I have to say looking at the circuit I cannot see why the mosfet would fail. I have only tried it a few times on the bench though, so interesting that yours failed after some use.

Assume you just put one in series with each output? Shaun you had better do this. Something like a 1N4001 should do it, what did you use I'man? I will go and scratch my head again and try and work out why there are failures, must be missing something.

Rich
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injectorman
I tried 1 amp diodes but it didnt work (i did check the polarity of diodes as I know they work only one way)
Bought 3 amp diodes but ran out of time=(
What burnt out was the tracks on board rather than component.
Hope this helps.
Cheers
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S
Just been testing had some success.

1) Left new sensor board alone and converted one of the sensor boards in use, back to standard and put it in half straight sensor track.

TESTED with different CLC's and it worked as it should. One side active which ever corresponding CLC was attached. SO this board NOT damaged. (good news)

2) Placed diodes across pins of the female socket where it's legs go through the PCB (no camera on hand tonight but i did a drawing, will try get a pic and post it.) Tested and it worked as i hoped, it switched a LH Out to in CLC from either of the 2 sensors on the board.

3) Put sensor back in racing line, and make same diode mod to second sensor board for CLC.2.

4) Connect cables from sensors S2a & S2b together and connect to cable from flipper/solenoids on CLC.2.

I TESTED and all 4 sensors from the 2 sensor boards successfully opened and closed the one flipper from CLC.2.


I DID NOT use diodes when connecting the two 'Sensor Boards' together in No.4) (where the blue dotted circle is on the diagram but figure i should or current could run into up the other sensor board... Would you recommend using diodes here or will it be OK as it is in the diagram.??

5) Then i converted sensor board S.3 back to standard to check for damage, but had no time to test if OK as had to stop. I will continue there this weekend.

TO CONCLUDE...

CLC .1 works as normal from 1 sensor

CLC .2 works as normal but from 4 sensors, mounted on 2 separate boards.

CLC .3 yet to add diodes. (Aim to get 2 sensors mounted on 1 board to send signal to flipper).

Rich & Iman
Thanks you for taking the time to test/help with my questions it is appreciated.

A nod if you think the diode placement is ok would be great too. ( i just hope the it works part is not short lived).

Shaunbmx

@ RichG

I had some 1N4001 diodes but then found something that was smaller about half the size not sure what it was, as they are all in loft right now but seems to have worked.

Will check what diode tomorrow.

Shaunbmx
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injectorman
Check with Rich re diodes, RichG sees no reason why it shouldnt work without diodes and I have no reason to not agree, but like I said, tracks on boards were melted twice when actually tested in track, worked on bench for a while, did you check for visual signs of damage?
Yes putting it back to normal for a minute should give you the answer.
Sounds like a after market board is needed?
Cheers
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S
17
Its been a little while since i posted my progress on the racing line.

I did get both sides of the sensor board giving a signal to one of the jack plugs using diodes and i did wire the boards in parallel so giving me four sensors on the curve for the approaching LC.

It worked but it was kinda messy (see under track) and still only 85 - 90% on the sliding cars hitting the sensors.

There had to be a better way and i wanted a strip of sensors. I got some different Infa read detectors / sensors and tried several. Most of them worked but some suffered affects of ambient light.

The best ones can be found in this #18 and #19 of this thread:

OPTO SENSORS, Which one to use

I will try and keep this on track withe the racing line transplant with this thread.

Its been a lot more work than i expected especially when i comes to the wiring and fitting of the flippers and sensors but i can't wait till the last one is done and i can try all the racing line parts of the track together.

I have several pictures so i will not say much else as they show the progress.

IN TO OUT EXIT AT THE TOP OF THE HILL








In this shot you can see the strip of sensors.




TIME TO CLIP THE CURBS THROUGH THE ESSES














And here it is almost finished.


The two combined in the circuit.


The strip of sensors to catch a sliding car.


On this one i mounted one just on the inside of the rail cutting slightly into the rail. If a car is going real slow and the led is placed quite far back on the car then it often rides above the rail its self and can miss the sensor but now it cannot escape detection.


Shaunbmx
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D
Great work, love to have a drive of that!
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Z
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QUOTE Its been a lot more work than i expected especially when i comes to the wiring and fitting of the flippers and sensors but i can't wait till the last one is done and i can try all the racing line parts of the track together.No way Shaun!! That is RAD!!


Fantastic progress on your project. I really like how it's all coming together for you.
The racing lines you are choosing look like they will make for a superbly smooth lap. Nice job.


Do i take it that wherever i can see sensors on the track, there is also a sensor in the centre slot position (as per standard sensors)?

Thanx for all the pix, i look forward to seeing more of your track as you press on.

I certainly looks like you have put some serious thought into the development so far, and with the sky backdrop already done, i have a feeling that your track will look fantastic, once completed.
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I
3
I just want to echo Zipp's comments, fantastic work great planning but all far to clever for me.
Though I want to see this project develop looks like it is going to be a brilliant track.
Definitely one to follow well done


Ian
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MattZani
2
i think they all look superb! Are you going to custom make all the Lc's? i see a standard XLC, surely you want to make it longer!
unless its a slow section of track...

What are the white lines for in this section of track?


Matt
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RikoRocket
Wow! Shaun this really takes SSD onto a new level. Forget scratch building cars, this is way more interesting, scratch building digital tracks. Awesome.

Riko
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