Great idea, good luck. Let us know if there is anything we can do to help.

I've moved it, and pinned it, and will look into giving you full editing capabilities.

Please be aware that any email addresses published openly will be picked up and spammed.

 

Hmmm. Is the rules landscape that confusing? Are there that many peripatetic racers?

Whatever, adopt our rules* and we're all good to go, I'd say.

*Pretty sure we nicked our Slot It and NSR rules from somewhere else.

 

Ooph. Just took a quick butcher's at the CSCRA 1/32 rules (PDF). Detailed. Pedantic. Hardly open, welcoming or cost-effective. That way madness lies. I hope that ain't the intended direction.

 

Wankel Ickx
Thanks for the contribution. Are you one of the UK's slot peritapetic racers? If not you could make it one more than current.

You can influence this from joining in either as your clubs representative or being part of the discussions had by your club and fed through your representative. Flicking pebbles from the outside are not the way to influence.

Matt

 

Have just asked the members of the "East Devon Slot Racing Club" if there are any volunteers to represent our club.

Great idea, if we could travel to other clubs. knowing that the rules for each class of car, were common to all clubs, that we intended to race at.

 

This approach is defiantly an interesting concept, I had seriously thought about a similar central repository for club rules and regulations in the past, even going as far as buying a Domain name.

However, if the usual handful of "big" clubs dominate and drive the agenda, I'm not entirely sure what it would actually achieve.

 

Although not on the list above (yet), we do run hard body 1/32 cars in our WHO/digital offshoot. Most of the WHO/digital 'build guidelines' (as we call them) are adapted from other groups' rules - mostly DiSCA, plus the CSCRA Trans-Am RTR for our Trans-Am class.

The word 'adapted' is important. We've found it important in both our HO and 1/32 racing that our classes and rules fit the spirit and practicalities of our club. The health of our club is ultimately more important than strictly adhering to a common rule set, if that makes sense? Having said that, I'm pretty sure we'll all take interest in this thread discussion and I'll message through my details.

Here's a link to our 2019 digital racing guide: www.whoracing.org.uk/who_digital2019_season

 

However, if the usual handful of "big" clubs dominate and drive the agenda, I'm not entirely sure what it would actually achieve.

Hi SavMolo
Please take the spirit of the initial communication exactly as it is. No hidden agenda, at this stage just trying to get details of any clubs that are interested in being part of this. Does Melton want to be part of it?
Matt

 

Hi Matt,
Can you add moleseySCC@hotmail.co.uk to the Molesey listing please and fw14b@sky.com to GT Raceway.

Thanks.

 

Won't be a moment.

 

Er? I think I asked a couple o' fair questions and stated an opinion, as a nudge to influence. You gonna have to be open to such if you want a consensus and avoid that, already stated by someone else, big clubs will dominate nervousness.

Which is to say, I didn't post with the intention of flicking stones.

I mean, I'm sure John would, if he wanted, be nominated as Oxford's rep, but I must've been absent when we voted 'cos I don't recall any discussion on that score. Just sayin'.

However, what is the opening pitch with the single class? You've something in mind, I assume?

 

In my opinion a "standardised class" across all clubs would be a great practice and a great proposal, with the addition of making the ability to hold inter club events a lot easier. The only down side is you will never be able to please every body.

In my eyes a great standardised class would be a cheap affordable class with basic class limits that would give every range of racer from the rookie to the seasoned vet a chance to race and be competitive.

Eg,

A box standard SCX "GT" car

Motor limitations - RX-42 / 42B ( which ever motors are equal now as not sure on some of the newer classing)

Tyres - standard or a Choice option ( like one set grade of slot it tyre)

Car tuning - no

Gearing, motor, wheels etc - Standard as per factory

And maybe even a controller limit? ( like a standard parma as 90% of people have these kicking around)

Tyre cleaning - Tape ( to stop the cross contamination and films forming over the track)

As listed above I see that this would be a cheap class that would give any racer the opportunity to race for all of £30 or have a car already suitable, and be competitive as every racer is on a base level and it comes down to skill not money .

The problem with this is that you would get a group of people complaining to be able to swap gearing, motors etc to improve their cars, and use their £100 + fully adjustable controller. But the hard reality is that this select few that would kick off for these additions are usually the people that without having an upper hand (and the money to throw at it for a slot it flat 6 and metal gearing, pricing a lot of racers out of being competitive) are the ones that aren't competitive with a standard car/controller combo and end up down the bottom of the field and kick off due to the fact of being butt hurt.

But as has been mentioned above I would have to agree from what has been experienced at some contests that no matter what there is a few of the nationally known clubs, or "powerhouses" within the club scene that would get the overruling decisions, and over looked when bending the set out rules/ limitations.

Regards,

Your friendly neighbourhood slot car racer

 

I mean, I'm sure John would, if he wanted, be nominated as Oxford's rep, but I must've been absent when we voted 'cos I don't recall any discussion on that score. Just sayin'.
However, what is the opening pitch with the single class? You've something in mind, I assume?

I presumed John, but he said he would be happy for you to be the club's representative. Suggest you chat the next time the club convenes.

This thread is about gaining interest from clubs and them to nominate a representative. This is not a thread about classes and rules etc.

When a distribution list is put together I am sure the discussion will be interesting and hopefully get to a point of getting at least a majority concensus on whatever subject matter is raised, which I would hope will add benefit to all clubs (incl Rockingham) if the clubs wish it to.

Matt

 

In my opinion a "standardised class" across all clubs would be a great practice and a great proposal, with the addition of making the ability to hold inter club events a lot easier. The only down side is you will never be able to please every body

But the hard reality is that this select few that would kick off for these additions are usually the people that without having an upper hand (and the money to throw at it for a slot it flat 6 and metal gearing, pricing a lot of racers out of being competitive) are the ones that aren't competitive with a standard car/controller combo and end up down the bottom of the field and kick off due

But as has been mentioned above I would have to agree from what has been experienced at some contests that no matter what there is a few of the nationally known clubs, or "powerhouses" within the club scene that would get the overruling decisions, and over looked when bending the set out rules limitations.

I have taken some selective parts of your post that I will respond to.

First paragraph - great, we are on the same page. I suggest you ensure your club has a representative.

Second paragraph- completely disagree. This is evidenced for example by our clubs annual Xmas open to all free event were we run club Ninco Mercs completely unfettled with the same car on each lane and club Parma controllers. Everyone runs all the cars and suprisngly the racers who are on top in regular racing are on top again. Completely level playing field. We race the same principle on our BRSCA track at the same event, and we find ourselves beaten by multi national champions James Cleave and Gavin Wills. Talent shines through, although it is embellished by talent in building and tuning cars.

Third paragraph - sorry you feel that way, this hopefully offers an opportunity to partake and influence the discussion no mater what club you are.

Matt

 

Eg,

A box standard SCX "GT" car

Motor limitations - RX-42 / 42B ( which ever motors are equal now as not sure on some of the newer classing)

Tyres - standard or a Choice option ( like one set grade of slot it tyre)

Car tuning - no

Gearing, motor, wheels etc - Standard as per factory

And maybe even a controller limit? ( like a standard parma as 90% of people have these kicking around)

Tyre cleaning - Tape ( to stop the cross contamination and films forming over the track)

Regards,

Your friendly neighbourhood slot car racer

• If this idea is to hold any water at all first off the classes need defining.
• Then we would have to actually define 'Hard body' as a lot of clubs allow other non vacform bodyshells.
• Single manufacturer single car type isn't a "class" if we're talking national rules, this would lead to hundreds of classes and totally unworkable.
• These proposals are for club use, most club members I know only use adjustable controllers and are only ever seen using standard resistor controllers in Slot Stox as the club owns the right ohmage. Overly restricting will see this idea die before it starts.
• Our club uses CSCRA as guidelines to prevent arguments and certainly works for the classes we use it for (Pre F1 GP cars) which enables club members to race nationally at clubs using CSCRA rules which is what we want here for hard body classes.

Maybe we need a poll compiling for clubs to select and add to see what is happening around the country. We try very hard to limit the rules at MSCC but they seem to evolve every year as boundaries are pushed after ideas are added to last years edition. I fear this may be too difficult a task as one manufacturers 'standard' isn't the same as another manufacturers 'standard' even for the same car.

 

Does Melton want to be part of it?

It is something we should definitely consider, it will have course have to be discussed with all members with a willing volunteer to take on the role.

An "association" of some kind is something this part of the community is dire need of. But is has to be there to support, help and promote clubs of all sizes, where each clubs input is valued and treated equally. However, as I have already mentioned, if the management structure is the same faces from the usual clubs, then that does cause me some concern. Just look to the success of DiSCA and the BSCRA, who are actually both governed completely differently.

Now onto the positive, as I had previously given this plenty of thought, the following approach I was going to take could be used as a good base to build from. You will never get an agreement for a general set of rules; there are too many clubs with different aims and interests;

• First, define the nomenclature; all clubs need to talk to each other with the same language. For example, what is a "class"? We technically only have 2 different "Classes" but eight "Series", each "Series" then falls under one of the classes (it was a way to massively simplify the rule-set). Then some clubs use "Class" to define every single different championship they run, all with very different regulations.
• Adopt only a couple of rule-sets, the old "National" 'NSR GT3' & Slot It 'Group C' is probably a good place to start. They are very even and have enjoyed success in the past, I bet most clubs will run something very similar, or have something the cars could easily fit into.
• Define some standardised race formats. We are pretty bad at this ourselves, "Grand Prix", "Rally" & "Enduro", will lack all meaning to pretty much everybody who comes to visit.

 

We are a new(ish) club and would be very interested in seeing some guidelines set, I have just listed us on the directory page, Woodland Fort Slot Car Club in Plymouth, Devon.

We are running the old Four Lane Blacktop track and currently dont have ANY classes, running Libre every week, but we intend setting up some regular classes/championships soon.

Anyone is welcome to contact me on here, or email: bernie.lawrance(at)gmail.com or via Facebook (username Bernie Lawrance) or via our clubs page or group https://www.facebook.com/Woodland-fort-slot-racing-club-Plymouth-165658397340622/ <a>or https://www.facebook.com/groups/woodlandfortslotcarclub/</a>

We get regular visits from Rob Lees and have had a very competitive showing from the East Devon mob, but anyone is always welcome

That's the plug out of the way, I am willing to represent our club on here

 

Well, I really tried but, what can I say, I'm weak: "hard body", snigger.

Right, got that out of the way.

The initial objective is to create a master list of all interested clubs and their nominated representative so that we all can communicate with more ease.

Why? You're asking for representatives' emails and mobiles in order to communicate with ease; how could that be any easier than posting suggested rules here and having the debate here?

But is the idea that these duly elected representatives (I'm not going to use the word cabal)(D'oh!) quietly and secretly thrash out a specification and then return to their constituencies to put it to their members? When they 'convene'?

Count me out, for starters.

Which is to say, I have zero desire to be involved with what I presume (My turn) is the intended format.

Look, assume folks are interested; all those clubs listed on Slotforum. All those clubs with members visiting Slotforum. Now, give it a go here, on Slotforum. You surely have some idea of where you think we could start.

Here's what I think - as box-standard as box-standard can possibly be and no electronic controllers*. Dull as feck but not intimidating to newcomers.

*Never going to be adopted

 

I have taken some selective parts of your post that I will respond to.

First paragraph - great, we are on the same page. I suggest you ensure your club has a representative.

Second paragraph- completely disagree. This is evidenced for example by our clubs annual Xmas open to all free event were we run club Ninco Mercs completely unfettled with the same car on each lane and club Parma controllers. Everyone runs all the cars and suprisngly the racers who are on top in regular racing are on top again. Completely level playing field. We race the same principle on our BRSCA track at the same event, and we find ourselves beaten by multi national champions James Cleave and Gavin Wills. Talent shines through, although it is embellished by talent in building and tuning cars.

Third paragraph - sorry you feel that way, this hopefully offers an opportunity to partake and influence the discussion no mater what club you are.

Matt

Hi Matt,

From my comments I wasn't saying that there isn't talented slot cars racers but there is definitely a large gap that the better equipment makes just upgrading controllers I personally have gained over 1.5 seconds per lap with the same car.

Despite you disagreeing with my second comment, your comment back this up in a way as when everyone is put on a level pegging field it comes down to the skill of the driver and not money or ability to tune the car, as there is no tuning parts or parts to swap. Everyone would have the same level of car, same motor, same tyres, same gear ratios so the talent would shine through not the money.

 

Hi SavMolo
Please take the spirit of the initial communication exactly as it is. No hidden agenda, at this stage just trying to get details of any clubs that are interested in being part of this. Does Melton want to be part of it?
Matt

Hi Matt,

Sorry for throwing my 2 pence worth in again but I'm just picking up on my comment of certain clubs dominating the hobby and your quote "No hidden agenda".

On the ISRA as below.

So international Reps would have to agree the rules set out in this. But currently as far as I'm aware, I don't believe that currently there is a UK representative, correct me if I'm wrong?

But it's interesting that on the Rockingham slot car club Facebook page a few days before that it was being suggested to be apart of this.

So it's not because Rockingham are looking at starting a UK association, but are actually looking to enter the ISRA "hard Body" world championship next year, who themselves are currently looking for national delegates...... But who would the representative be, the guy who's proposing this and currently wanting to get into the ISRA race?

Call me a conspiracy theorist if you like but it all adds up and seems more a plan to give some of the bigger "powerhouses" within the hobby more power and control.

 

James

You presume far too much, conspiracy theory at it's greatest. The ISRA UK delegate is currently Graham Lane, from Shepton 'Powerhouse' Slot Car Club. He stepped up and should be applauded for this, although he is saying it is all quiet on that front for the last 3 months

Pleased you read our FB updates, always feels like you put the effort in but no one reads them!!

Note as chairman of Rockingham (and prior to that Wellingborough) Slot Car Club I have taken the club on a journey of embracing all forms of racing and making the club a core club in the national scene. The fact that you view us a powerhouse makes me think we have done alright at that, all through our members energy, commitment and drive.

So we have rally tracks galore, an oval, digital, and are planning a drag strip alongside a BRSCA track and a scale track - oh and the nationals BRSCA facility next door. Rooms built with our members own hands and all tracks paid for by the club finances (£5 a week for up to 3 nights racing each week). A decade ago members were active in BRSCA and the classic racing scene, but members bemoaned the fact we never held a national scale event and never would. We now hold many national events, actively supporting DiSCA, CSCRA and other national series, and our members are probably the most travelled and active at other clubs.

So getting on to the ISRA concept. I think it is interesting so why not be part of it. Rather be inside, enjoying and influencing than outside begrudging it.

To bring this thread back to it's original purpose, don't forget names and numbers if any club wants to be on the inside - an always open offer no time limitations.

Matt

 

Right! On with the tin foil hat! As soon as anyone says, 'I have no agenda but here's my suggestion' my Spidey-sense starts to tingle.

It's still not a bad concept, mind. I'm off to Google these ISRA folk and see what they're smoking.

 

Ok,

Before this thread gets any more off topic, I think a few things need to be clarified, because otherwise it just proves on thing: We all think we know best and "don't need any help thankyou very much!"

This conversation was actually started over on that well known social media platform called facebook (you may or may not have heard of it). Not by Rockingham, but by Molesey SCC. More specifically, by me and boy, am I starting to regret my choice of username now...

The whole purpose of the conversation is to try and bring as many clubs together, to talk about ways that the current epidemic of poorly attended club nights can be addressed (if at all), in an attempt to stop any clubs from having to permanently close their doors due to lack of funds.

It is nothing to do with ISRA or entering a team, or drivers for ISRA or adopting ISRA rules in the UK! There was a delegate selected for the UK by ISRA (nice of them), but as none of us elected that delegate, it makes the whole thing rather laughable.

So put simply, there is no conspiracy going on. We merely believe that if we put our heads together, rather than having them banged together, we might just might be able to help each other out, if only by bouncing ideas off one another.

There is no plan at this time to start an association or appoint anybody as 'leader'. It's just a conversation amongst an ever decreasing number of people with a common interest. If it gains traction, then who knows where it might lead? Maybe nowhere? But at least we've tried!

One idea is maybe to come up with a mutually agreed class that clubs could include in their calendar (if they want to) to try and establish some kind of standard across the UK.

It's a start...

 

To this simple minded outsider, the idea of some kind of standards for racing seems like a good idea. Everyone would know where they stand. Clubs wouldn't have to run all events to those standards but for a national event it would certainly make sense and there seems to be quite a bit of travelling to different races going on.

Quite why anyone would immediately scream conspiracy theory I don't know. It just seems to be the norm for the modern audience. When the hell did it all start? There is a difference between between checking on what is going on and assuming that everyone is out to screw you somehow.

Perhaps the internet really does 'form' opinion now rather than reflect it.

 

Someone called Ecclestone acting as the voice of reason in the context of motor-racing (Okay, model motor-racing)? Shurely shome mishtake?

Anyhoo, thank the baby Jesus it's not ISRA-based 'cos I did not get very far at all with this peachy document - http://isra-slot.com/documentation/rulebook/. Not before my neck muscles protested at so much shaking of my head in disbelief. It's a massive target if throwing stones is your thing. Massive. I heartily recommend you have a read. Take a pebble.

Anyhoo, here's my proposal: Scalextic; box-standard, analogue cars.

Nothing more. Nothing less.

The science bit... Well, this being the UK, Scaley being the UK brand and since, nine times outta ten when a stranger rocks up at Oxford they've a crystal case with a Scalextric car in it under their arm (which we all then pour gentle scorn on) it makes sense to take a long view and play the newbies' game for a while, lure them in, make 'em comfortable, before introducing them to exotic foreign delights.

Done.

Sign below if you agree.