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WE DON'T ALLOW THAT

10K views 130 replies 32 participants last post by  P944guy 
#1 ·
Is a phrase i've picked up a lot over the last few years, and why don't so many clubs le peoplet run newer faster cars , this is stopping new interest in the sport, surely rules bloody rules can be adjusted to let all enjoy.
I no longer race in a club as there ain't any round here , but when i did i liked to try the newer cars , i'm not stuck in the past where i try to resurect my old Ninco, i can't get the parts for it so we would all be in the same pot scrabbling around trying to keep the old tank going so i buy a new Slot it, NSR, Thunderslot instead, and enjoy the enhanced performance .
Low and behold i buy those terrible out of scale nasty nasty Thunderslots , why because they look good , go good and do me good driving them at racing speeds,, i have always thought that progress is what keeps things going along.
Don't get me wrong i love the old cars which mostly i have updated but i will get told sorry mate you can't race that we don't allow that here at this club which seems to be the way of lots of you.
Now this might wake up the dead and the dying chuckle. 😎
 
#3 ·
Wood Green North London is the place for you Mr Gunn.

It's very much the modifiers club. We do have a couple of near stock classes, Group C being the strictest, even then, gear/pinion changes are allowed and for 2022 all points scoring rounds all cars must have 1mm clearance under the motors. All cars run on Ortmann tyres.

The rules are sooooo relaxed that I'm considering entering a Sideways BMW M6 GT3 in our Touring car class! Yes, even thought it says "GT3" on the wings. As long it's a 4 seater saloon, even 2 door coupe, it's apparently OK as a Touring car.

We have choice of 4 motors, Slot It MX15 (21k), Slot It Flat 6 yellow, ScaleAuto Tech-1 S Can & odd ones ....Fly Evo2 or Ninco NC2, yes no one is bothering with the last 2. It's either Flat 6 or the Scale Auto. In-line or sidewinder only set up.

I don't agree with it so it's a bit of protest entry to show the absurdity of current rules. I expect things will tighten up for 2023. For now, the extra wheel base and track might have an advantage of standard Slot it Calibra, Merc and Alfa 155's. There are 3 well sorted 3d chassis SCX touring currently leading the charge. I have tested the M6 with in-line flat 6, nothing special and not quicker or easier to drive the Calibra with the ScaleAuto motor. So this set up with ScaleAuto motor in-line is my last attempt, with a gear ratio change possibly....

Photo to follow...

Max
 
#4 ·
Saloons is the biggest headache of all, Bentley Continental GT...4 seater..."but it's a GT" yes but it's not a 'Sports' so what class does it go in?

Spirit Peugeot 406 Coupe...another problem car but goes in our Saloons but definitely only has one seat.
 
#5 ·
That Calibra is looking good to chase the leading trio of 3d chassis SCX cars.

Motor vehicle Electrical wiring Gas Circuit component Computer hardware


I'd like the M6 to better the Calibra, taking advantage of the longer wheel base and wider track, all within the specs for this class.

Background Ninco Jag's with the excellent Amato chassis, old cars back in action for Good Wood

It's not a touring car in the same class, really???
Car Vehicle Wheel Automotive design Motor vehicle


Max
 
#8 ·
You need to come down the South West, Woodland Fort in Plymouth to be precise, we have classes for everything, from standard Scaley/SCX/Ninco (Production Saloons) to Libre where the car of choice is a Richard Mack Genesis chassis, we allow modified or scratchbuilt cars in all classes (saloon has it's own Pro class)
 
#9 ·
Is a phrase i've picked up a lot over the last few years, and why don't so many clubs le peoplet run newer faster cars , this is stopping new interest in the sport, surely rules bloody rules can be adjusted to let all enjoy.
Um? Someone rattled your cage this morning, Mr Gunn? Whatever, I think I need a citation to back up the sweeping, 'this is stopping new interest in the sport' claim. It is? Really? Really? 🧐

Also one for how our hobby became a "sport".🤔

I would say this, not everyone is a speed-crazed moron wanting to run faster cars. Not everyone wants to fork out for new releases. I'm currently a bit frustrated that Revoslots aren't currently exciting enough punters at Oxford to make a class likely. Ditto, very sadly, Sideways. But when a club only just has enough members to make it viable you gotta go with the consensus.

Maybe, since you're motivated and don't have a club nearby, set one up, set the rules 'n' reg's and see how it goes? 🤷‍♂️
 
#10 ·
I have my own club here Mr Wankel ( hope i spelt that right chuckle ) and have only 4 rules .
1. Drivers must bring their own drinks , prefebly single malt.
2. No food to be eaten by the race track , encourages the spiders.
3. All drivers must take a turn at marshalling,
4 Ladies to wear trousers, bending over in short skirts distracts the drivers.

Simple rules and a great evening is normally had by everyone especially after the 4th scotch , being serious for a nano second , done all or nearly all you suggested , still have no real club which i miss a lot , and still beleive in less rules the better fun.
 
#11 ·
One might argue that the thing that you don’t allow is regulation or standardisation.

There’s always a balance to strike, which some clubs and organisers achieve better than others.

Slot car racing is one of the few competitive disciplines which can represent a different thing to every single person in the room. Trying to please them all, is of course, impossible.
 
#12 ·
This is and always will be a contentious subject, but rules in general are always instigated to slow down the fast drivers never to force the slower guys to speed up ,shame but it has always been thus,
example ,if someone finds a massive performance improvement within the rules the default position is prohibit or ban never ,make everyone adopt it so you can all go quicker.
and as they say
if I’m wrong I’ll give you the money myself
but I think my dinner money still safe for now:D
 
#14 ·
This is and always will be a contentious subject, but rules in general are always instigated to slow down the fast drivers never to force the slower guys to speed up
I mean. They could always just learn to drive faster? I think Mr zero5 argues this in another topic just yesterday..

If more honest conversations were had around the fact the “fast guys” are fast because they’re actually good drivers and not just because of their car choice or spec then maybe rule makers would not need to create this artificial barrier that prohibits the inevitable rainbow chasing of the back markers who think they’ll just go a bit quicker if they had the latest XYZ..
 
#15 ·
I no longer race in a club as there ain't any round here
If you are no longer racing at a club and you can still hear the voices, may be it's time to cut down on the single malt ;)
example ,if someone finds a massive performance improvement within the rules the default position is prohibit or ban never ,make everyone adopt it so you can all go quicker.
Alan, surely it's the other way round, those who find massive improvement are tinkerers and checkbook racers, not fast drivers.
Fast drivers are rewarded by club classes were all cars are equal and their superior driving skills can make the difference.


Joel
 
#20 ·
Thinking back to when i was a club racer in the early days it was all a learning curve, Friday night was race night , Saturday was tinkering trying to improve from others there who were either faster than you or had faster cars , their is a differance.
Kevan has hit one nail on the head to up performance e.g tyres and prepping tyres, i have been amazed over the years how many drivers don't put out decent tyres , seen some right horrors doing proxies , and the owner wants to know why his car is a dog .
It's all in the prep , and ability , my brother was faster than me just a fact but in endurance racing i always beat him, why ? i was more consistant over the longer period and stayed in the slot , which is another way of being faster, stay in the slot.
Dopamine is right about club cars but even then we found one car was just that little bit better than it,s stable mates , a lot of the time is being consistant that is the name of the game , drive in your own ability not others.
 
#21 ·
What I find humorous is how often those who complain the most about BOP or handicapping or various rules that "level the playing field" are often on the podium. They'd probably be on the podium just as often in races that have all the restrictions and handicapping, so why the kerfuffle? I have personal experience with such a person, who was also found to be the most adept at following the letter of the rule, rather than the spirit of it. He wasn't TECHNICALLY cheating, but he knew darn well that his interpretation of the rule was counter to the intent. But why? I can only assume that he had some kind of insecurity that would be exacerbated by any more losses than he felt he was personally due for (none).
 
#23 ·
What I find humorous is how often those who complain the most about BOP or handicapping or various rules that "level the playing field" are often on the podium.
They're more interested in retaining their advantage than they are in promoting close racing.

In my opinion, what clubs need is a benign dictator in charge of the rules, one who understands that close racing is the best way to keep and attract members rather than rules that mean the gap between the best and the worst drivers is huge. Someone willing to implement handicaps to some of the racing classes so that the weaker drivers have at least some hope of being reasonably competitive. The handicaps needn't be so large as to make it possible for a weak driver to win, merely large enough so that he doesn't finish miles behind. Sadly, that type of club doesn't seem very common.
 
#27 · (Edited)
Then you need to work on your persuasiveness, Grunz. :giggle:

I race at a traditional club and love doing so, but also run race meetings at home fairly regularly. Tired of the same old NSR, Slot.it, Scaleauto, Sideways rocketships, and the more usual methods of racing that clubs use - fixed-time races where highest cumulative distance wins, or fixed-distance races where quickest cumulative time wins - I implemented my own rules and classes which, despite initial scepticism by some, have proved popular and successful.

I wanted to race Pioneer Legends when most of my "racer" friends turned their noses up at such cars, so bought and modified a fleet for us all to use. Likewise with a fleet of Carrera vintage NASCAR and also modern Scalextric BTCC. Yes, most "serious" racers won't give a second glance to a Scalectric BTCC car because it's poorly built and slow (and I concede that they're justified in not doing so. The cars' mechanical bits are sh*te) so I bought and substantially modified a fleet, retaining the body, chassis and motor, but upgrading everything else, and now that class is one of the most requested of all the classes we race.

We race two classes per meeting, one where the drivers build and supply their own cars and which caters to the common NSR-type club-racing classes, and the other where one of my fleets is raced. Each of my fleets consists of at least twelve cars. Drivers are free to choose any of the cars, but must use a different one for each heat.

Instead of cumulative time or distance, heats a scored with points, 4, 3, 2, 1, so a disaster in one heat doesn't necessarily mean a driver's entire race is ruined. Everyone races once in each lane, points are totalled, then, depending on the number of people competing, drivers are seeded into last-chance, quarter and semi-finals, all leading to a single final.

My track is typical four-lane Ninco where the outside lanes are slightly slower, so to handicap the best drivers and give some hope to the worst, the lowest qualifying driver for any last-chance, quarter, semi and final is given first lane choice, the second-lowest gets second choice, and so on. This sort of reverse-seeding does occasionally mean that the best driver doesn't win, and it can lead to tactical racing where drivers deliberately try to qualify artificially low down so as not to get last lane choice in the final, but it works well.

"Build it and they will come" is the saying. If you believe strongly enough in a format and can be reasonably persuasive, "organise it and they'll enjoy it" is often very true.
 
#26 ·
If I ever go four lanes and approach "club racing" on the track I think I'd have three classes. Race what you brought (analog), spec class (stock without magnets, custom tires and guides} and finally identical club cars (voted on spec - everyone chips in to purchase them). Something for everyone and most would probably want to race in at least two of the classes.
 
#29 ·
Part of these choices by clubs is simply to reduce some of the cost and also reduce the number of redundant cars that members have sitting on the shelf because they are no longer competitive.
We try to introduce one new class per year and that class is run close to standard for the first year.When raced again limited upgrades are allowed.
But even though we do restrict some cars over the years you still end up with redundant cars.
 
#36 ·
Human nature seems to come into rules , can remember in the mid 60,s and things were really hot slot car wise and there were loads of clubs in Essex and we went inter club racing which was great fun until the rules got bigger and bigger .
The so called fast boys normally managed to benddddddddddddd the rules in some form or another, others just started to give it up as regards a hobby , they could not afford to do it anymore .
Then there were the engineers who came up with some great ideas so once again rules were ammended because through their skill they gained a advantage especially in the brass chassis dept
Now i look on from the sidelines have my own 2 lane track in the garage , can go down there with who ever wants to come along and play slot cars , there are no rules just a bit of nostalgic fun , but i still miss the club days, think we all learned a lot and things today have not really changed on that score, bet there still is the good the bad and the down right argumentive competitors in most if not all clubs.
 
#40 ·
The so called fast boys normally managed to benddddddddddddd the rules in some form or another, others just started to give it up as regards a hobby , they could not afford to do it anymore .
Which is why I argue that box-standard, single make classes are easier to police and more attractive to newbies.

Liberties can be taken, of course, but the playing field starts off looking more even and the liberties are smaller.

...bet there still is the good the bad and the down right argumentive competitors in most if not all clubs.
Hmmm? Which would you say you were, then? Back in the day?? 🤔

And which would your contemporaries have said?😁

P.s. Oxford doesn't currently have any argumentative souls and we're one of the grid slots for @zero5 - top five last time I looked in that National Drivers' League thing that makes me giggle - a very competitive fella.
 
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