[gaincell]

Hello, everyone!! Hope I might be able to get alittle help here. I just came across what I believe to be a 1967 Champion of Chamblee Cat # 104BB. It is a Corvette body with stamped alum side-winder chassis and the 707BB motor! Front axle, rims and tires appear original. Spur gear is a 48t cox, not weldon but rear axle appears orig, same as front. However, the rear wheels & tires "silicone" appear to be non-orig to the car. My question is - does anybody know what would be the best rear wheels & tires to put on the car for running pleasure, hard or, soft? I think I need something at around 1-1/8th in OD. x around 1/2 inch or so. As the corvette body has a few small cracks at the front & rear bottom edges, I will probably take some time to repair and just get a "re-issued" lola body and paint it for running. The car had quite abit of running dirt and I've cleaned it up pretty good but I still have to take the motor apart to clean & lightly lube it! Thanks!!!

 

[PETER GUNN]

Morning Gaincell and welcome, i used to race these types of cars in this period along with Revell & Monogram many of these had threaded axles and i do not think you can get these axles and wheels anymore, i ran mine with soft M.R.R.C diamond rubber ( no longer available i think ) on them before replacing them with 1/8th blanks and going on to sponge tyres, if you contact S.C.D on 01274 682120 and speak with Chas Keeling or E mail him [email protected] he may be able to help you out or suggest which way to go, on home track surfaces like Scalex, Carrera e.t.c i always use soft rubber. Cheers Keith.

 

[dgersh]

Gaincell,

All depends on what kind of track you'll be running on! If it's anything but wood, that 707 is going to be way too powerful!

Silicone should work well on most wood tracks - if they're clean. If people are running glue you might have to go to a modern foam type tire, with some "tire traction" additive.

Champion used a kind of posi-lock system on plain axles, not threaded... very hard to find these, but other kinds of silicone tires can be found on ebay. (AJs the most common)

If you don't mind wild colors, the Candies work best, but very hard to find in basic black.

There are also Ortman and other urethane tires that could work on some types of surfaces, and I believe a company called Indy Grips makes replacement silicone tires, but maybe not for these wheels. NSR might work as well and they do a vintage line.

Depends where you are too, US? UK? as to which dealers are closest.

Don

 

[Rob J]

Keith (Peter Gunn) said he didn't think we can get 1/8in threaded axles and wheels any more.
Patto in Australia has 1/8in threaded wheels in his range. That's at http://members.optusnet.com.au/pattosplace/
He has various tyres too.
Many of us oldies also have parts we don't need. I have surplus unused 5/8in-wide alloy 1/8in threaded wheels, single flange, and probably a few axles that I could part with.
What's wrong with your present rear wheels, gaincell? Do you want to return to original specs (and what are they)?
I assume we talking of 1/32 scale and your "1-1/8th in OD" is tyre size. If not, apologies. I don't know the original.
Rob J

 

[dgersh]

Nope Rob, that's 1/24 scale, which was pretty much all Champion did at the time. The 707BB was their top of the line motor until the 16D and 26D models began really taking over in 66-67.

A 1-1/8 x 1/2" tire would be pretty standard for these models, and a lot of the AJs silicones are this size. That's about the size of the wider Monogram rears too, as well as a lot of other models.

Champion made special sets, with their own silicone tires molded on posi-loc hubs and vanadium axles - over 3 bucks at the time, definitely high end!

Not sure what Corvette body that would be, or if it's an original Champion. Probably a Grand Sport, since the chassis was pretty wide!

Any chance of a photo?

Don

 

[gaincell]

Greetings, mates!! I am here in the US. And a big Thanks to all of you for your prompt replies!! Yes, 1/24 scale and I definately have a pair of "threaded" vanadium axles, nice and hard! Funny, just two months back I saw on ebay a pr. of nos rear sponges in blue "in the orig clr plastic case w/ wheels and posi-lock components! I should have bought them but as of then hadn't owned the car. I did however grabbed the picture! By the way, the rear tires that did come with my car ARE in fact what I believe to be "candies"!! Light blue and white swirls and silicone! So, yes, I could just get a pr of 1/8 x 5-40 threaded wheels with tires. Honestly gentlemen, I'm really not sure just what the tracks here are currently made of but, I do remember the wood ones of the 60's! So, I would imagine that I should find out what's closest to me that sometime still runs the "oldies"!!! For the moment however, I would like to open-up the motor and give it a "thorough cleaning" and slight lube for it came looking like it had just completed the 24 hr Lemans run.. Looks like it has never been open for the tabs are good and no paint is cracked! There are however allready the two small holes atop & underneith where "if necessary" small screws can be used to secure the endbell which by the way IS the later Celcon "air-cooled" one with a bb in it, also! "I would love to post pics for after I did a general cleaning of the body and chassis parts, I took MANY"!!! I was like a kid, for this is the car that I ALWAYS wanted but, it's cost back in the 60's was like almost a new bike! But, I remember well their domination..

 

[dgersh]

Ah yes, the Champion cars with the rewinds were something like $15 to $20 - way beyond my budget as well!

And a couple of them did do a sort of demonstration endurance run for about 80 hours, with the motors running perfectly all the time - so maybe you have one of those cars!

Sounds like the guy definitely changed out the original tires for candies and a threaded axle, which should actually simplify things for changing wheels - but the Candies often hold up very well, even 45 years later...

Don't think too many tracks in the US run vintage events, but they would welcome you to run the car I'm sure! And just wait till those kids see a good old-fashioned wheelie!

Don

 

[gaincell]

Thank you, dgersh! It's exactally what I'm looking forward to!! Seeing the faces and yes, especially the kids for that should really bring back that wonderful memory!! I suppose I should look for some more of the candies because mine do have a problem on one of the tires, "a flat spot" and bad enought that it cannot be trued without loosing critical diameter for 48T spur. I do read of a few places here that have vintage events but I believe your right, not many and not really an "event"!! I wonder what basic Controller I should get? Definately don't want to spend big bucks, however. I still have my orig COX MKIV but, there's probably alittle better by now! I presume by now you all have figured that it's been "some time since I've last run a car", actually I think it was sometime during the early 90's here in los angeles, calif., somewhere over in the san fernando valley. And "I had a ball"!!!!! Can I post pics here? I would be happy to post a few...

 

[janj86]

the problem is most newer commerical tracks run more than soft 12 v we use to use ,, more like 14 volts and they will fry a old motor and controller in a hurry ...

 

[dgersh]

If the power supply is clean, the motor might survive, but the risk is always there. The Champion motors were very solid in fact.

No problem posting pix here, there's a tutorial somewhere, but bascially you have to host them somewhere like Photobucket, then click on the "Insert Image" icon above and paste the URL address from that site into the box. Photos should be reduced to no more than 800 pixels wide too...

Is your Cox controller the variable one? If so, it would probably run the motor at 5 ohms - but you're right, the modern controllers are a lot better, and some of the Parma economy models are pretty cheap (basically just updated Russkit trigger finger types!). I don't know about you, but when I started racing again, I just couldn't get used to using my thumb again - tried a few vintage controllers, but then went totally trigger-finger, and have gone through a bunch of them since, including a few electronic models!

Don

 

[gaincell]

Thank you, Don! Funny, that thumb thing I was actually worring about, also! Seems like trigger finger was destined to be the way! My old COX isn't the variable one. I'll look into Parma's econ models - Thanks!! Still trying to find a decent set of rear tires & wheels to go with this car. Finally cleaned up the car really nicely though! After taking the chassis apart I used very fine steel wool and polished it, including swing arm and motor bracket! Then I opened up the 707bb motor and removed balanced arm and first cleaned can and magnets - man are those arco magnets STRONG!! then I cleaned the endbell and then slightly lubed both bearings and was successful closing the motor back up without breaking either of the two tabs! "I was ready to drill however" but, was not needed, this go around! New Lola clear body & new set of guide brushes are on way to me from Electric Dreams just a few miles from me here in los angeles. Thinking about a Racing Blue for body color. Anyway, will post a few links to some pics, shortly..

 

[Bigtone]

You could have the original wheels responged with Parma or Supernatural rubber. Parma also do non threaded 1/8th wheels tyres and axles, they also sell self adhesive clear lexan so you could repair the original body if you prefer to keep it.
Tony

 

[gaincell]

Thanks, Tony! Here goes a try for directly looking at my Photobucket Link of my Champion Car as I got it and some of the cleaning I've done so far..

http://s1055.photobucket.com/albums/s511/craftsman3006/

 

[TSRF]

Your car is a stock Champion Corvette, that used the Champion painted Du-Bro body. The rear tires appear to be original bur clearer pictures would tell. The spur gear is not shown but the car came with two kinds; a Weldun 64-pitch setup with a collet pinion and a collet aluminum red anodized gear, or a 48-pitch 50T Williams plastic spur gear and a steel Weldun pinion.
Are you sure that you have a Cox gear?

 

[dgersh]

?? The rear wheels definitely look like Candies to me... Not sure how to tell about the gear; I had actually forgotten about the Williams gears, but I think they were similar black plastic to the Cox types...

Don

 

[gaincell]

Thank you, gentlemen! The spur gear says COX 48T 4340 and the pinion is definately brass 14T w/ collet!! Really neat for you don't need a puller to move it, just a small 3/16" wrench! Will post a few more detailed picks for you..

 

[janj86]

glad someone else appreciates the the old champion .. just found a porsche ...

 

[dgersh]

Show us photos of the Porsche! Is it one of the 36D sidewinder cars or a more recent inline with 26D?

Unfortunately, a lot of people appreciate the old Champion cars, judging by the prices on ebay... and there are almost none still in the box, since these were all bought to be raced right away!

Don

 

[merkit the grof]

Just thought I would show the actual pictures (as they are already hosted)

I really like the pinion, but can't help wonder if it is a reliable way of securing it

Joel

 

[dgersh]

Thanks Joel, always nice to see the pix.

I can't imagine Champion would do something like that if it didn't work... still, I never liked the collets, whether on K&B, MRRC or anywhere else. It wasn't so much staying on, but I always had trouble removed them even when the nut is loosened!

Don