SlotForum banner
1 - 20 of 23 Posts

·
Registered
Joined
·
460 Posts
Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hello all. I'm hoping I can get some insight on my scenario and know I'm in the right place to ask for help, as I been reading the forum for some time and have come to see there's some very knowledgeable people around here
I hope you all can help me out.

I have on order 2 Slot.it SCP01a controllers in hopes that they will work without fault in my setup. Here's a diagram of how the track is wired.



It's Carrera track and I previously wired the original Carrera plunger controllers to work (you can see my notes under Controller Hookup Lane D) with XLR connectors. They just don't work anymore and it's time to gain control of my cars!
All my cars are stock from Fly, Slot.it, Carrera and Scalextric.

My first question is will they work with the PS(power supply) I have?
I was not sure what I read on the forum about the controllers being electronic and they need a certain PS to work properly.

Second, will I still be able to use the switches to change the lane direction, or will the controllers only work for when the switch is in one position?

Thanks,

Looking for help
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
230 Posts
The issue isn't the power supply itself (but the Pyramid is an excellent choice).
It's more if you wired the track for positive polarity or not. The Slot.It controller is wired for positive polarity.
I'm not a wiring expert, so I can't tell if your diagram shows positive polarity or not.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,504 Posts
The diagram shows a positive polarity wiring setup, and the SCP01a is the standard positive polarity version of the controller (std. level power handling) So YES, you will be able to use the controllers you have on order.

In your diagram
The Red (positive) from the power supply is shown going to white at controller hookup, which in traditional slotting colour terms represents the positive side of a controller.

The black negative from the power supply is shown going to the red position of the controller hookup (negative), yes, sigh traditionally, red is negative in controllers, which will then form the "dead short" to provide braking when the trigger is fully released.

The black wire OUT of the controller hookup is the positive voltage feed to the track after it has been "modified" by the controller.

In the case of that diagram it goes through a DPDT switch, to create dual direction driving options on the track.

Lastly, the same negative feed which goes to the "brake position" of the controller, also goes directly to the other rail of the track via the same DPDT switch.

It is the DPDT switch "reversing" the positive to negative feeds to the track which creates dual direction driving, it is after the controller, and the controller has nothing to do with this part of the wiring, so YES you will be able to use the track in both directions just as you do now.

Just make sure you wire the SCP-1 correctly into the XLR plug.
The Slot.it manual does provide directions for this, and colour explanation including the twisted history of controller wire colours


My track is wired just like this by the way.
Pre-wiring, including a lot of light circuits for scenery to be added later.


Finished driver panel
 

·
Rich Dumas
Joined
·
3,599 Posts
I believe that the posted diagram shows the negative polarity scheme, which is what plastic tracks use. The Slot.it controller will not work with a negative polarity track. Here is a diagram for a standard positive polarity track that includes a reversing switch. The reversing switch is after the controller, so electronic controllers will work using either direction. If you put the reversing switch before the controller the track polarity would change when you switch directions and your controller would only work in one direction. What is actually changing with the two wiring schemes is the direction that elecrticity goes through the controller. Resistor controllers work either way, electronic controllers only work one way unless they have dual polarity.

 

·
Registered
Joined
·
460 Posts
Discussion Starter · #5 ·
Thanks guys for the responses.

Nice track slotcrazy!

So RichD, to change to a positive polarity I just need to feed the DPDT switches with the negative from the battery? that would make it a Positive polarity? it's an easy fix, if that's all it takes...

Glad to hear that my PS will work and I can still switch directions


Should I add a fuse block like shown in the diagram RichD posted? Will that add protection to the controller in case of a short on the track?
 

·
Rich Dumas
Joined
·
3,599 Posts
When you have reversing switches changing the polarity is very easy, just reverse the wires at the power supply and change the reversing switches to get the cars going in the right direction. My HO track was originally wired with negative polarity, but when I started holding races on my track I decided to change to standard wiring, so I reversed the wires at the power supply and reversed the wires at the track rails. My track has screw terminal connections and the wiring has spade terminals, so that was very easy.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,504 Posts
Looking at it again Rich is correct, sorry I was wrong. (very discreet in your correction there Rich)
I just read the wire colours at the XLR socket, which showed white for positive etc in usual controller, didn't look properly at the circuit. - I blame the coffee - not enough of it.

RICH, take a read of what I have put below. It may make his life easier.

In theory you could simply reverse the connections at the power supply, so it became a positive polarity wiring system, PROVIDED that you wire up the positive polarity controllers for the correct pins to match the sockets.

However, do consider that if other people will bring controllers to your track, whether THEIR controllers are wired to utilise the same pins as your wiring. You do not want to have your track wired in conflict with those of other hobby slotters in your area.


This is what would happen.

By reversing the wires at the power supply, you would have
1) PIN 3 the positive from the power supply going to Pin 3 of the diagram - which will be the positive feed of the controller (which is the white wire on most controllers, or yellow on a Slot.it one),

2) PIN 1 the positice voltage output of the controller (the black wire) would go to pin one, which then feeds the DPDT switch and on through to the track.

3) PIN 2 would be receiving the negative feed from the power supply, and would be the brake wire of the controller (which is the red wire on the controller). That same "wire" continues on to the other side of the DPDT switch, and then of course, on to the track.

As always, when you do something like this, document it, print out this, or write something, and tape it under the track.
Add to the written information, the colours of the wires used from the XLR socket in the driver station to each lane and what they now represent.

- Some day in the distant future when you or someone else comes to do work on the track, such information is invaluable.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
460 Posts
Thank you for the clarification guys, I really appreciate the help. So here's what a correct Positive Polarity schematic should look like, based on your comments and helpful diagram. Is this correct?


The next question is - should I include a fuse block on the + feed to the controller WHITE terminals? What would that help, if any? I ask because I see it in the diagram RichD posted. And what should the fuse size be?
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,504 Posts
Heya Dingleberry

yes, the looks correct - the colours at the XLR block repreenting the colour of the wires on the controller (except slot.it's SCP01a has a yellow wire instead of white, but i sitll think of it as the white.)

Now the black negative from the power supply goes to the controller red wire, to form the dead short the makes the braking effect in the circuit when the
trigger has been fully released;, and carries on to the DPDT to feed it's side of power to the track.

I confess, I MEANT to put a fuse in the circuit on my latest track, forgot to do it when pre-wiring, and was too lazy and cock-sure I had everything right, that I never went back and put it in. Being a permanant setup, and being the one who wires up nearly all the guys controllers in our club, I have not been too worried about a controller plug wired wrong or shorting. We don't take tools near the track to short it, and that just leaves the cars, which havw way less robust wiring than the track, so they would cook first!

It IS a very good idea to do so.
If you just put in a single fuse first out from the supply, you want a fuse value that will blow before a controller gets damaged, or something cooks wiring.

If you are only going to run 4 x stock RTR cars, a 10 amp is probably enough, even if you have a 25 amp supply - those cars will never blow it, as most RTR motors draw less than 2 amps at "stall", and a whole lot less most of the time. IF you use a standard fuse holder, you can easily change the fuse value later anyway.

If you want to really protect controllers et all, you could put a 3 to 5 amp fuse on every controller circuit instead/as well.
BUT - the SCP1 controller is so well protected by it's internal re-triggerable fuse, plus the 3.15 amp replaceable one inside the cartridge, that individual circuit fuses are not needed, and just another thing to develop a fault one day, some day....

Oh one other thing. Most of the circuit diagrams we see have been produced in the USA, where wood tracks are really common. A large percentage of those use either aligator clips or banana plugs for controller hookup, so there is always the possibility of a guy carelessly putting a connection on a wrong terminal while distracted...
With a pre-wired 3 pin plug such as an XLR, which can only be pushed into the socket one way, the chances of something wrong from the user end are greatly reduced.

I notice that SCC and others now promote XLRs as a controller plug option.
Australia uses a reversed round mains plug, and in my country we use XLR for RTR/hard-body, and the long established metal chassis racing clubs use the plugs like you see on electric kettles.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
460 Posts
Great! Thanks.
Now I just have to make the simple modifications to the track wiring (probably take me five minutes), wait for the controllers to arrive and solder on the XLR's. With what you mention about the controllers having good protection, I guess there's no need to add the fuses for each controller station. There won't be any outside controllers connecting to race either, as it's only a family affair.

I'm really anticipating the new controllers to be a world of difference from the old, stock carrera plungers.
 

·
Rich Dumas
Joined
·
3,599 Posts
My club, Shoreline Model Raceways, seems to have popularized using XLR plugs on 1/32nd tracks in the US. The owner of Slot Car Corner is a member of the club. All of our tracks use XLR plugs, when we did joint races with other clubs the visitors liked them so much that they converted as well. I expect the a majority of the wood 1/32nd tracks in the northeastern part of the US have them now. The standard way to wire XLR plugs is Black (wiper) to pin 1, White (power) to pin 2 and Red (brakes) to pin 3. Most of our tracks also have screw post connections in parallel with the XLR ones. Since not everyone will have fuses built into their controller it is best to have a fuse or breaker for each driver's station. If you use a big aftermarket power supply do not rely on the fuse in that alone to protect your wiring and controllers.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,504 Posts
Ahhhh Hi Rich. I see you onthe forums, but had no idea you were part of Shoreline.

And yeah, I knew the Shoreline SCC "connection" [pardon the pun] thing myself, but didn't like to say too much about it here, in case it was taken as a promotion for SCC.
I deal with Steve and Dickie myself on a pretty regular basis, dang nice guys. They know me as Mark in NZ say hi for me.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
460 Posts
The reason I originally decided to use XLR's is because my nephew (now 6) can't connect the controller the wrong way and fudge something up. Aside from me having a lot of them from being a custom A/V tech. Glad to know they're becoming an industry standard! I probably won't have issues if and when I decide to search for a local slot track.

RichD - exactly how you mention the XLR should be wired is how I plan on wiring them. I made notes of it previously and wrote it on my schematic.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
460 Posts
Discussion Starter · #14 ·
Well, here's a bit of an update... Track is now rewired as per the schematic.

I received the 2 controllers on order and after 5 blown cartridge fuses realized my brother had the + and - terminals backwards on the power supply
After swapping them I could not get one box stock car (actually all my cars are box stock) to go without blowing the standard fast-blow fuse, so I put in a slow-blow and all is good. Does anyone have any ideas as to why the fast-blow would be blowing almost immediately?

On a sour note - One of the controllers' trigger is stuck and I'm having a hard time trying to get it to work properly. You would think it'll take a minute to fix, but I'm going on 2 hours and no go
No matter how I tighten the screw, it sticks when trying to move it. It worked fine for about the first hour of use. Any ideas??
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,504 Posts
Something isn't right.

here's some questions to maybe isolate the cause

What voltage are you running?

What size motors, and what level of magnetic downforce (if any)

What amperage fuse are you running. Normally 3.15 amp is recommended..wierd value, but it is a standard value in electrical use.

Are you using regulated power supplies?

Are you sure you don't have a partial short somewhere, or one lane cross wired in some way.
(disconnect all but one lane from the powerm put a 3.15 amp fast blow in a controller, and use it, if the fuse doesn't blow, reconnect one more lane use both at the same time, and so on.)

It is strange that a 3.15 amp fuse would blow before the "retriggerable fuse" switched off the circuit. They usually click out faster in the case of a circuit fault or short, than the user replaceable 3.15amp fuse.

I haven't blown a fuse on a Slot.it controller in about two years - I run one myself, and a lot of weeks loan out another to new members.
For non-clubbies using my own track, I always have at least a couple going.

cheers

mark
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
460 Posts
Discussion Starter · #16 ·
Hi Mark, I'll answer your Q's in blue below

QUOTE (slotcrazy @ 29 Feb 2012, 04:00) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>Something isn't right.

here's some questions to maybe isolate the cause

What voltage are you running? Adjustable from the front of the power supply (range is from 6-15), normally have it at 15

What size motors, and what level of magnetic downforce (if any) All cars are completely stock from the box, no upgrades in any way, shape or form (Slot.it, Scalextric, Fly, Carrera)

What amperage fuse are you running. Normally 3.15 amp is recommended..wierd value, but it is a standard value in electrical use. Stock fuse amperage 3.15

Are you using regulated power supplies? My power supply is listed in the schematic and is a regulated supply

Are you sure you don't have a partial short somewhere, or one lane cross wired in some way. Positive there's no short on any lane and none are cross wired in any way. To check for a short, I put a car on the lane in question and jumped pins 1-2 on the controller hookup - the car moved on every lane and I got no sparks from any time I connected the jumper wire
(disconnect all but one lane from the powerm put a 3.15 amp fast blow in a controller, and use it, if the fuse doesn't blow, reconnect one more lane use both at the same time, and so on.) Is it OK to just disconnect the + from the controller hookups? What if the fuse blows with only one lane connected?

It is strange that a 3.15 amp fuse would blow before the "retriggerable fuse" switched off the circuit. They usually click out faster in the case of a circuit fault or short, than the user replaceable 3.15amp fuse.

I haven't blown a fuse on a Slot.it controller in about two years - I run one myself, and a lot of weeks loan out another to new members.
For non-clubbies using my own track, I always have at least a couple going.

cheers

mark
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
460 Posts
Discussion Starter · #17 ·
Regarding the stuck trigger... the Store I purchased them from is sending me a new controller sans cartridge. Great customer service.

When I receive it, all I have to do is plug in my cartridge and race!
 

·
Rich Dumas
Joined
·
3,599 Posts
When Slot.it first introduced the orange endbell motors they were prone to shorts across the commutator segments, if you have one of those you could easily blow fuses. The test you did would only tell you if there was a dead short, it might not reveal a partial short.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
1,504 Posts
Hi Dingleberry
in haste, heading away for a few days.

15V is pretty high. You could try
a) running at 12V (and you may like it lower......esp. now with better controllers giving finer control) - see if problem reduces, or goes away
Identifying as Rich says, if certain cars on track will trigger that. Could be a comm thing, or could be a braids short.
Check the braids on every car. If you have a stray strand of wire shorting across the top of the guide, or underneat due to length and "straggle" it will get you every time. And that mauy only short as the car turns a corner.

Still strange that the FB fuses blow so regularly at 3.15A instead of the re-triggerable fuse shutting the controller down. Indicates a pretty solid overload.

- We found that on our Ninco track, that one deslotted car running across the lanes and shorting out the track at another lane was my main cause of fuses popping, but that was wayt back, when scp1a V1.0 had a 2.5 amp fuse. Maurizio sent outa the memo saying to go to 3.15amp andthe problem pretty much went away from then on.

- You have just experienced the service Slot.it like their dealers and distributors to give - nice eh! gives confidence in the product.

One more thing, if you are able to have a multimeter with a "memory hold" hooked up beside a controler station to one lane at a time, in current mode, and see what peak current spike you get, it may help clarify if you are getting say a dead short via the wiring or a car.
 

·
Registered
Joined
·
460 Posts
Discussion Starter · #20 ·
Wow, see, you learn something new every day! Thanks guys for the input.

With my Fluke 112 multimeter, where do I connect the leads to check for the amount of amps a car is pulling?
 
1 - 20 of 23 Posts
Top