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Discussion Starter · #1 ·
Hi, i've just seen this slot car that has been sold on ebay..and i've lost it..


http://www.ebay.com/itm/OLD-YONEZAWA-JAPAN...=item27ca528c06

And the seller said to me it was the only one he saw in 40 years..

So, my question to the forum's walking encyclopedias is: have you ever heard about it before..? And if the lucky buyer reads this message..well, i'm ready to buy it from you at the price you want..


david
 

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'Fraid not David! I noticed that one too, and it was the first time I've seen it... plus, it's a private auction, so we can't even guess the buyer's ID!

Good luck! There was a lot more variety in Japanese slot cars than we ever suspected...

Don
 

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Discussion Starter · #3 ·
Thanks for your help anyway, Don


The point, in my opinion, about production and rarity in vintage Japanese slot cars is that sometimes we don't really know if something that is rare, or really rare outside Japan, is equally rare inside that country..

Many times we labelled some Japanese slot car sets and/or slot cars rare, very rare, scarce, etc. but maybe we should just label them as "exotic" items, because maybe, if we could browse Japanese blogs and websites, we could discover that they're not so rare at the end..


What made me think this one could be a case of a really rare item, and not just an exotic one, is the way the seller replied to me, when i asked him if he could find another specimen for me..he said that this one was the only one he saw in 40 years, and that he was not going to see another one anymore..a quite definitive sentence..


But maybe he's a bit pessimistic..


And you're right, Don, the sale was private, but there could be a last chance to find the buyer..: checking in the next weeks the feedbacks left and questioning who left them..and maybe..but just if feedback is left, of course..

But who knows, maybe some well known museum could be the one who bought it..


david
 

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Well, that does narrow it down a bit David! Woncer where it will pop up...?

Good point about the Japan "in and out". Not sure about rarity, but friends who have dealt with Japan a lot say that stuff is not any cheaper there - and it's sometimes more expensive!

The Rarity bubble has burst for Mexican, French and other Scalextric cars, but not sure about the Japanese models....

Don
 

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QUOTE (merkit the grof @ 22 Aug 2011, 15:44) <{POST_SNAPBACK}>David, I agree with the split, but up to a point. Nobody, but absolutely nobody knows for sure how many numbers are left of any one slotcar (How could you possibly count them?).

The numbers left may change how much you are prepared to pay for them, but only if you are in competition with other collectors who also understand the significance of the cars (As in an Ebay auction).

David, in many respects, this is a nice follow on to a previous discussion.

If I was a canny Ebay seller and someone asked me to track down something, perhaps. I would be tempted to say " Never seen another one before" especially if I had another one for sale.

Now, I am sure this particular seller is totally genuine, and meant he had never seen another mint unbuilt kit.

Thanks to him, we all know it is rare, but is it desirable?
Being very rare does help; but, what if it is just another casting of the well known LS body?

After all, IKKO. Yonesawa, LS, all made the Porsche 904; I can't believe there are 3 sets of moulds floating around Japan, a reasonable scenario is that they are one and the same. Which put the word rare into perspective.

Just to keep you amused for a while, here is one I found earlier. (Needs a good clean, but nice condition)




Joel
 

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Discussion Starter · #6 ·
Hi Joel, yes, in somehow we're continuing that discussion..


To be honest, to me the declaration of the seller, that he'll never see another one in his life, looked a bit excessive, because if Yonezawa really produced that slot car, for sure they didn't produce just one..of course, it can be something really rare, but so unique..? Even if, looking around, i've noticed that no one has ever mentioned before the existence of a Yonezawa 1/24 slot car, so maybe it could be a prototype or something produced in a very limited edition..

But as you rightly said, maybe the car in itself is not at all that rare, because it could well be an LS marketed under the Yonezawa brand (and the seller didn't provide any pic of the chassis to understand that..)..so, if that's the case, the real rarity could be just the box..even if exactly some days ago, browsing slotblog about another rarity i don't recall now, i understood (if i'm not wrong) that Monsieur De Lespinay said that this seller in the past was known to have created some vintage boxes (attention: not repro but totally new..) to fill them with some vintage slots..i don't know which evidence Monsieur Philippe had to support that, but if it's like this, in this case we could find an IKKO or LS inside a not original Yonezawa box..so, in this way, voila' a former totally unknown Yonezawa 1/24 come to light..
But we don't have any evidence, so..who knows..anyway, it's certainly odd that so far no one had ever heard of this slot, after more that 40 years..

Anyway, if the car was genuine, i'd have happily paid 1,000, 2,000 dollars and even more for it, because to me, like all the people who are trying to build a kind of encyclopediac collection, it's something highly desiderable..even if it can't compete with the fame of a Cox, Tamiya, etc..

Let's hope to have some more news on this slot..


david
 

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Oh, Yonezawa did make slotcars, the picturre of the Porsche above is yet more evidence of that, and I have seen a Lotus F1 also branded Yonezawa, it was from the same seller as the 904, but, no reason to believe he wasn't correct.

Funnily enough, there is an IKKO on ebay at the moment.

Joel
 

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Discussion Starter · #8 ·
Hi Joel, sorry, maybe it's the summer heat
, but i didn't understand..

The slot you showed is a Yonezawa? If so, the seller was really pessimistic..


Me, searching on the net for Yonezawa 1/24 slot cars, i didn't find any result..just some tinplate cars..if you can be so kind to explain me better..


Ah, by the way, where's the IKKO you were talking about? I didn't see it..

david
 

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Joel and Don,

I think that after a few years of searching for every possible Japanese kits and RTR models. we have narrowed it down quite a bit and there will be very few "new" discoveries. Parts, motors, chassis, bits, yes. Kits? Our listing is now near double that published in 1998 by Model Cars in Japan, and that was the most comprehensive listing ever published by that time. Of all the ones listed, the LASCM now has about 95% of them. We are still looking for a few elusive examples of kits or RTR models we know exist, but so far have not surfaced. In any case, let's talk about Yonezawa a minute.

Yonezawa began its toy business in the early postwar years and became one of, if not the largest toy companies in Japan. By 1965 when they briefly dabbled in slot cars, it was a huge conglomerate producing thousands of tinplate toys, with friction, windup and a large number of battery powered models of cars, aircraft, ships and novelty toys.

Yonezawa toys are also branded Yone, ATC or sometimes Cragstan, depending of the commercial agreements with American and Japanese distributors. Yonezawa's most famous toy is that of a large Indianapolis car, a representation of the 1952 Indy-500 winning entry driven by Troy Ruttman. The toy was vastly successful and many are still found today. The tooling was later sold to GEM in France, then to another toy company in Germany.

Apparently, Yonezawa only produced two slot cars in the 1/24 scale, both RTR, both copies of American offerings. The first was a Lotus-Ford copied straight from the Revell model, the second a Porsche 904 copied from the Monogram model.

The LASCM acquired both at the same time a few years ago and indeed I had never previously seen either of the two models.

PLEASE CLICK HERE to see detailed pictures of the two models.

The LASCM was not involved in the bidding in the auction mentioned in the opening post of this thread, since it already owned a perfect example of that toy.

as someone mentioned an IKKO kit of the Porsche 904, here is what it looks like:

j209_1.jpg

Another very close copy of the Monogram molding. The Japanese were not too embarrassed about saving pattern-making money...
 

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Discussion Starter · #10 ·
Bonjour Monsieur,

Many thanks for your explanation, even if I think you forgot to mention me when addressing your so exhaustive reply..but maybe slot racing makes people feel younger (it's just about toys, at the end of the day..) and bring them back to the long lost primary school days, when a child upset for some reasons could say: "I talk to you and to you, but not to you, because you made me cry..!" That's brilliant..


Ah, anyway I think I've found who bought it..


david
 

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QUOTE even if I think you forgot to mention me when addressing your so exhaustive reply

Actually, no.
 

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Discussion Starter · #14 ·
"Aut tace, aut loquere meliora silentio", monsieur pdl..so, you just missed a good opportunity..


(for people not familiar with Latin, that roughly means "don't talk, if you can't improve the silence..")

Anyway, I thank you again to have found the time to give your pieces of information, stopping for a little while from your precious work at the LASCM..actually, this acronym is for Los Angeles Slot Cars MUMMIES, right..
? They're all so wonderfully preserved..the rooms are pyramidal, I guess..and you learned these so excellent preservation techniques when you were part of Napoleon's Egyptian Expedition, right..
?

Don't worry, just joking a bit..

david
 

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QUOTE Philippe, unexpected information about Cragstan distributing Yonezawa, until now I had always assumed they only dealt with Hong Kong stuff.

Thanks

Joel

Hi Joel,
Cragstan was Craig Stanton, a gentleman with his base in the Chrysler building in NYC. Cragstan imported a lot of Japanese tin toys: TN (Nomura) was one of their most favored factories and lots of Nomura toys bear the Cragstan label. ATC (Asahi Toy Co. Ltd) and Ichiko were other brands that provided lots of tin toys to Cragstan for distribution in the USA and Canada. Marusan plastic model kits of aircraft were also at one time, products available from Cragstan. Before Atlas made a deal with Marusan for the slot cars, Stanton imported a few kits, but that stopped after 1965. Marusan products were also marketed in the USA by Louis Marx Co. of NYC, and there was of course Linemar, Marx, really, that have various Japanese factories producing toys for them. Marusan's famous '54 Chevy Bel Air can be found with both Marusan and Linemar trademarks seen below their rear window.
Cragstan and Yonezawa have quite a list of products where both names appear on the beautifully illustrated cardboard boxes. I have a large 1957 Ford with cable remote on which both names appear. But the toys themselves rarely bore the name of the distributors, the Japanese simply did not allow that.
 
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